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Rank the Star Wars Movies (so far).

furie

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Come on, ROTJ has everything. You know it to be true.

Best space battle? Check - battle of Endor.
The Luke v Vader lightsaber battle is awesome, so is Vader's redemption (minus the special edition Noooooooo).
Leia in a bikini - awesome.
It also gave us Jabba, another plus.
See, almost (though clearly another who can't get beyond the end of Tatooine with enough blood to their brain rather than elsewhere)...

The issue I have is that Star Wars literally wrote the rules on how to make a Hollywood blockbuster. Empire followed those rules and scaled it up (actually, turned the epicness on its head - Empire is a funny one).

ROTJ ignored them.

Basic rules are:
Action intro
Heroes Journey (hero meets wise man, goes on adventure to rescue somebody).
Peril that the hero overcomes/resolves.

ROTJ doesn't do that. It's a slow start, then it wanders a bit after Tatooine and then there are THREE perils to overcome at the end. There's no focus, but lots of Ewoks.

I think it starts well. Tatooine and Jabba's palace gives us a glimpse for the first time of a much wider universe. It's diverse, clever and works really well. I actually love the start of ROTJ.

Then there's the whole Luke visiting Yoda thing. It's a bit bland and a nothingy middle. Not much happens, no new revelations. Just "meh".

We then hit the "finale" which is a jumbled mess. There's the whole screw up on Endor with the Ewoks. That leads to the three pronged finale.

You have the surface battle on the moon, the death star battle and all this around the seduction of Luke by the Emperor and his final demise (spoilers :p ).

It flits between each scene, never giving any of them a chance to really shine. Just enjoying Han and Chewie fighting on Endor? Tough, we now have A-Wings against a Super Star Destroyer. Before that concludes..? Luke sulking in the dark.

Etc.

It's too busy. Each bit is individually good, but there's too much going on for you to get into. It destroys the tension.

Compare it to ANH and ESB where the finale centres on one conflict, with just occasional shots to other things to round it out - the focus in each is the Death Star Run and Luke's fight with Vader though. That's where the tension and captivation lie.

Oddly, TPM mirrors ROTJ at the end. It's almost shot for shot the same ****. Instead of Endor you have the attack on the palace. Anakin against the droids. Jedi Battle. All flashed between each and the whole thing as much of a mess. Yet people think ROTJ is awesome and TPM is crap - yet they used the same writing model for both.

I will always support TPM for the Jedi battle with Maul. I think it's one of the best sequences in the whole 8 cinematic episodes so far. It's just constantly ruined (as was Luke's battle and the Battle of Endor) with cuts to other scenes breaking the tension and interest.

But, at least nobody died of a broken heart :)
 

TommyAlex

Member
At least we can agree that a) the Darth Maul battle is epic and b) the prequels are trash. Especially Sith. I have never been more frustrated with a movie than Sith,
 

Pokemaniac

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Darth Maul was a total badass, though. One of the great mistakes of the prequel trilogy was killing him off in the movie he was introduced. It would have been awesome for him to have been a more recurring character, and meet his end in Episode III. Or as early as II, that could work too. Then again, the longer he'd be around, the greater the probability that he'd be given lines of dialogue, which would have ruined his image somewhat.

Then again, he was around for longer than Boba Fett was, way longer than Greedo and Admiral Ackbar, and even Obi-Wan met his end in the movie he was introduced. Even Yoda didn't have much screen time in the original trilogy. So perhaps they did the right thing by not keeping Maul around for long. Short appearances, without any opportunities to ruin a good first impression, might actually be a winning formula.
 

Howie

Active Member
Not strictly on topic... but too good not to share, especially for all you ESB fans out there (both of you).

 

furie

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That's fab Howie, though The Man from Del Monte is right, not as funny as your love of Ewoks :p

Darth Maul was a total badass, though. One of the great mistakes of the prequel trilogy was killing him off in the movie he was introduced. It would have been awesome for him to have been a more recurring character, and meet his end in Episode III. Or as early as II, that could work too. Then again, the longer he'd be around, the greater the probability that he'd be given lines of dialogue, which would have ruined his image somewhat.
Actually, they brought him back. He's a recurring character in The Clone Wars and Rebels. There's also a comic book series based on him.

But yes, getting rid of him in E1 and not bringing him back for the other films was silly. He's been a great character in the series. The latest episode of Rebels draws his storyline to a close.

Recently read the last of the Aftermath novels. It's okay and lays down decent foundations for the new stuff. It explains a bit of background about where the New Order and stuff comes from. It's good to round that out a little. Makes the scope of the new films look awesome.

It also finally gives closure as to what happened to both Jar Jar (I'll be Howie is desperate to find out what happened to his second favourite character after Chief Chirpa) and Lando. I won't spoilt it though :)
 

Snoo

The Legend
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I really liked the ending to Rebels as well. Very fitting.
 

furie

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I really liked the ending to Rebels as well. Very fitting.
It's been slated all over, but I thought it was a very clear perception of the journey the two characters had taken.
 

Howie

Active Member
That's fab Howie, though not as funny as your love of Ewoks :p

It also finally gives closure as to what happened to both Jar Jar (I'll bet Howie is desperate to find out what happened to his second favourite character after Chief Chirpa) and Lando. I won't spoilt it though :)
How wude.
 
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SimonSays99

Guest
A New Hope - this started it all, a great achievement for its time
Return of the Jedi
Rogue One
Empire Strikes Back - difficult middle-part movie, moving a story along without ending anything
(Rebels) - liked S2 finale - S3 not yet out here
(Clone Wars) - the voice actor for Anakin is far better than Hayden acting irl ;)
The Phantom Menace
Revenge Of The Sith
Attack of the Clones - the last two were rather bad storywise, IMO just putting 5 1/2 seasons of Clone Wars into two movies
 

davidm

Well-Known Member
^ yep but he has no credibility as has included Rogue One (and some of the furie-only fanboy things), but not Force Awakens. Opinion is void.
 

Howie

Active Member
^And that stomping noise you hear is the sound of @furie 's, lumpen feet as he marches with ill-deserved confidence towards this thread to regale us (again) with why that sequence is so much better without interruption from the Ewok shenanigans on Endor's forest moon.
Here he comes now...
 
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SimonSays99

Guest
Oh, yes - forgot Force Awakens! Most likely because its a A New Hope remake. Young forcewielder (Luke/Rey) get in the way of the Empire lead by evil goons (Tarkin/Phasma - Vader/Ren) and finds Jedi hermit (Kenobi/Skywalker) - and yes they also blow up a bigger and meaner Death Star. Adding some fan service with some actors of the classic trilogy. But nice effects. I would place it between Phantom Menace and Revenge of the Sith.
 
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