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Holiday World | Thunderbird | Launched B&M Wing Coaster

Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

^ Still, Gavin is right that you need a hobby.

I don't require some big queen to tell me need any more common sense knocked in to me thank you very much. I think I have enough at the moment, I seem to be going places. It's just very annoying when people speculate over literally every word. Yeah, you're excited. I made a joke about the over-speculation and you obviously took it to heart or something.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

I usually only watch LOGO for the Roseanne reruns. This is pretty entertaining.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

gavin said:
I just love that some people seem to think that all the "clues" are aimed at coaster nerds with an immense knowledge of coaster types, manufacturers, layouts and systems, rather than, you know, general advertising to a mass market.

The clues are way more likely to point towards story and theme rather than "B&M's first launched flyer, with lap restraints, 8 rows of 6 -across seats and an all new type of bolt on the airgates".

I need a new **** ing hobby; you people are ridiculous.
AMEN.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Man, some of you guys are serious "Debbie Downers". Who cares if Intricks is reading too much into the clues. It's fun, and having this discussion is a lot of fun.

The whole "Let's not read too deep into it" and "You're grasping for straws" argument is dumb too. Especially because this site is slow when it comes to posts, and having something to discuss, or dream, or whatever is a lot of fun, especially considering how long it takes for new posts in certain sections.

I honestly think it will be a B&M from the clues, but that's all I can say. I don't know if it will be a launched coaster, but I can be excited about it.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

^^^ I have one that apparently doesnt exist now.

Sorry for having fun ya'll. Im off to bitch and whine elsewhere for the day.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Do I think it's going to be a launched B&M? No. Is B&M doing a launched coaster out of the question? No. Especially when you think how rudimentary the launch system on The Hulk is.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

^ Yes, but the Hulk requires it's own power station which is used every time it launches.
I know LIMs are totally different, but launch coasters do cost a bomb to run. Holiday World do have money but I really don't know if they would buy a launch coaster.

Anyway, we won't know until they announce it.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Day 51

The terrible sound from inside the ship, we are told by the crew, was the cracking of a massive beam that runs through our ship. Mayflower’s mainmast is supported by that beam. A solution must soon be found or we may be forever lost at sea.

Words are happening.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

I honestly think its going to be a B&M I honestly don't think it'll be a launch coaster because even though they are ready to make it but its going to cost more and do you think holiday world will have that much money. I'm just saying putting it more into favour I think it's either gonna be a mack or something to do with the wooden coasters.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Small parks all over have launch coasters, cost of launch isn't an issue, a $30 million B&M is on the other hand.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

^ Actually cost of launch is an issue for a lot of parks. Even Bayern Park's coaster has to roll onto the launch track again to generate extra power for the next launch. Saves money and energy.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Yh that is what i meant because if you think of velocity at flamingoland they use the power from the last launch to launch the next train. I know B&M are expensive but I was thinking if it was going to be a launch it would cost alot more because technically it would be the first B&M launch coaster if you don`t count the incredible hulk because that launch was done by a different company.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Kennywood is quite small and I haven't heard these issues with them, but then again I've never heard of small parks having issues with launch coasters.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

But how much was Sky Rocket. Velocity cost £7 million and that has a reusing launch necause it costs nothing to use the same power/energy from the launch. How popular is Kennywood and do they have enough money to use a different launch. If I remember rightly as well Stealth at Thorpe Park uses the same power from the last launch on an off peak day as it is an easier way to save money for running costs.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

^ I don't think Stealth does, it's a cable launch.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

I really dont think cost is as much an issue as some of you are saying it is. Holiday World has been pulling in over a million visitors yearly for the past 7 years, and all expansions since Voyage have been rather inexpensive cost wise.

I really do think people are underestimating the park and how much revenue they make yearly.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Discussing revenue and capital of Holiday World will be a black box, as we simply do not have that information.

The information we do have is that the park's largest amusement investment was Voyage at $9 million. The next largest attraction was their 2014 additions that totaled $8 million, Pligrim's Plunge at $4.3 million, and Legend at $3 million (around $4 million when adjusted for inflation).

Since Holiday World has yet to make a sizable investment that would approach the average cost of a new B&M, Intamin, etc. - there is no trend history to indicate such insight.

Simply put, there are no numbers to back up large steel coaster claims at this point.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Ouch, looks like the amazing B&M Launcher theory might not happen, eh? ;)
I'm hoping for something like a Eurofighter or a similar model. At a push, maybe they could afford a small Dive Machine? Who knows.
 
Re: Bye-Bye Giraffica aka Pilgrims Plunge

Voyage was part of their Thanksgiving expansion as a whole, which total cost was 13.5 mil. They have publicly stated it will cost more than that, and be the largest expansion/additions in the parks history. So while what you said is true (that it can essentiallu just go back and forth endlessly til this is announced), lets look at some factors that are within HW favor:

- Their terrain. Voyage takes great advantage of it, and most theorize the new ride would too (who in their right mind WOULDN'T). It was stated in one of the many other threads, that a good part of B&M cost comes from the supports (not all, but a decent chunk of it). Keeping the ride low to the ground will help negate some of those costs. If true, then using the terrain could shave off maybe 3 million from its total cost.

- If this IS the launcher many theorize this to be, then that alone could potentially drop the price down 1-2 million (I am using general hearsay on this, as while it is not able to be proven, new types of rides seem to get installed at a lower cost (see Raptor@Gardaland)). So if this is hypothesis is true, then again we see cost drop a bit. If the total cost of the ride was 25, then its already been dropped to around 20 (again, this is all theoretical).

-If we use the given statistic of their annual gate price (which is what, 36 now?) and multiply that by their annual visitors (1.2+ million according to wikipedia), then that alone shows they make at LEAST 32mil a year alone from ticket sales (Im pulling 3mil because of random factors like Season Pass sales and their free giveaways). Take out roughly 20mil for expansion, employment costs and product fees (which I say is pretty high enough given Mayflower was their highest recent addition at 8mil), still leaves 10+ a year. Granted this is all assumptions, and would leave the park with a base of 70mil after that, I even say that is too high a number, so I will gladly drop it to maybe 35mil after all these years. That still is more than enough to cover Leviathan.

-The current footers poured. This one houses the most evidence towards manufacturer oddly enough. Each manufacturer cuts into their foots differently than the others, essentially giving their footers a "fingerprint" that sets them apart from the rest. Basically, if you can find me anotger manufacturer that uses the Almond Cut found on B&M additions, then you can disqualify the B&M theory as a whole.

As for going against the theory, their is only one main argument I have found, and that is simply stated as follows:

-It is a family owned theme park, they simply could not afford such an expensive ride based solely upon that alone.

Simply, you are right in that trying to argue with cost while having no form of data or access to that information is a moot point, but because they have never spent that amount before is also a void argument all on its own. They have run their park very smartly, and just cause they have never spent that high amount of money before, does not mean that they have never had that type of money to spend. Will was a very smart man, and was quoted as wanting to make Voyage the centerpiece of Holiday World before his untimely death. As such, he probably made the smartest and most inexpensive expansions while getting the most bang for the amount.
 
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