Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
See this is the problem with Merlin. They report such massive profits as a whole, and yet a park doesn’t have the budget to fix a ride. It’s just complete negligence.
Possible new ride/rollercoaster coming to Thorpe Park in 2019
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See this is the problem with Merlin. They report such massive profits as a whole, and yet a park doesn’t have the budget to fix a ride. It’s just complete negligence.
Chris Brown
Mr CoasterForce 2016
Looks like Thorpe are trying to claw out some positive PR after they officially announced the closure of Loggers, talk of infinity coasters and skywarps in the comments but it’s referring specifically to 2019 so no chance it’s a coaster.
Anyone know how long the licence for ‘Im a celebrity’ lasts? It’s lasted it’s usual few years for an actor lead attraction so could be getting some kind of retheme.
JoshC.
Strata Poster
The contract was for 3 years (2015-2017), with an option to extend for 1 year, which they obviously did. It has been removed from the website now, so I assume IAC isn't returning.
I don't believe that this post is hinting towards any sort of new attraction. In which case, they shouldn't be teasing anything imo and just announce it so we don't get ridiculous speculation of Gerstlauer infinity or Skywarp creds appearing out of thin air..
They also made a post a couple of days back with reference to 'HYPD'; an organisation which runs gaming events. If you look on their Twitter, they asked a famous Fortnite player if they were interested in taking part in a Fortnite tournament at the park.
Matt N
CF Legend
Just a little food for thought for you all... when Alton Towers announced the removal of The Flume during the off-season, there were signs up around the site promoting SW8 (Wicker Man) for 2018 by the time we got into the park for the 2016 season. Could a similar thing potentially occur here, but promoting a replacement for Loggers in 2020/2021? Of course no construction (presumably) will have occurred, but Towers didn't start removing The Flume until November 2016, so anything is possible, in my eyes!
Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
No, because there is no replacement for it. It’s not being removed to make way for anything else, it’s just being removed.
Matt N
CF Legend
We don't know that yet, though; we've been given no less information about replacement here than when Alton Towers removed The Flume!
Ethan
Strata Poster
I want to be wrong, but I agree with Crazycoaster here. It's really likely that nothing is replacing it. It's even more likely that they won't even tear Loggers Leap down and it'll be left to rot for years to come. I know you're an optimist and like to stay hopeful, but you're going to be let down here.
Don't worry though, the pessimism will come when the time is right xo
Lofty
CF Legend
I think the defining factor for 'replacing' is timing, and I think this is what you're not understanding fully, @Matt N
'Replacing' insinuates that this is being removed for a reason, it is being removed to make way for a new ride - hence something replacing it. This doesn't seem to be the case with Logger's Leap, it's just being REMOVED. The site may be used in the future, but up until then - there's absolutely no 'replacement' for Logger's Leap.
'Replacing' insinuates that this is being removed for a reason, it is being removed to make way for a new ride - hence something replacing it. This doesn't seem to be the case with Logger's Leap, it's just being REMOVED. The site may be used in the future, but up until then - there's absolutely no 'replacement' for Logger's Leap.
Matt N
CF Legend
Ah right, so you guys are referring to the fact that it's been SBNO for 3 years before the announcement of its removal, whereas The Flume was only SBNO for 1 month of Alton Towers' operating season before they announced its removal (after the announcement, it was SBNO for the entirety of the 2016 season.). Thanks guys!
Luca B
Mega Poster
The park have said that while it is in their long term plan for Logger’s area to be redeveloped, it is not their primary concern. Also for now we shouldn’t be seeing any announcement for a new ride, as they are more focussed on the special experiences available for the park’s 40th anniversary, which should be announced in the coming weeks.
Okay, so some new Thorpe Park news has surfaced, potentially exciting but maybe not, we don’t know at this point. Thanks to JoshC on another forum (Thorpe Park Mania) for some of this information.
Back in 2017, the park submitted an application to the local planning authority that would dictate that the park does no longer have to submit for planning permission for ride developments below 82ft in height and building developments below 16ft in height. The application seemingly remained dormant for a few years, presumably as the park had no interest (or more likely budget) in pursuing significant developments.
However, out of nowhere, recently the application has resurfaced, with a decision deadline being placed in mid April of this year. It seems for some reason there is now purpose and a desire from the park to having such a request approved.
Coincidentally, last week various aerial images of the Old Town/Logger’s Leap area of Thorpe Park made their way around UK enthusiast circles. These images showed significant tree clearance had occurred over the course of the 2020 season. The cleared area is long, straight, and narrow, and would seemingly be large enough to be part of an out & back coaster layout. GCI have said they have multiple projects ongoing in Europe, and with Wicker Man being a roaring success at Alton Towers with a similar theme already being deployed at Heide Park, who’s to say that Merlin won’t use a tried and tested marketable product at Thorpe Park.
Additionally, with the planning decision due by mid April (presuming a potential 2023 opening for a new attraction, if that is what’s happening) this would give the park time to prepare a planning application for a 2023 project should the April decision be a refusal. (Alton Towers applied for Wicker Man in June 2016 for a March 2018 opening.) While 82ft isn’t very tall, there are other GCI coasters like Prowler that are great rides and are in that height range.
Now, I’m not saying the park are definitely getting a new coaster, and maybe the tree clearance is for another reason, but I am saying that Thorpe wouldn’t spend hundreds of thousands on tree clearance and resurfacing an old planning application for no reason. Plus, the park are long overdue a new coaster and the timing of the two events is suspicious to say the least.
Back in 2017, the park submitted an application to the local planning authority that would dictate that the park does no longer have to submit for planning permission for ride developments below 82ft in height and building developments below 16ft in height. The application seemingly remained dormant for a few years, presumably as the park had no interest (or more likely budget) in pursuing significant developments.
However, out of nowhere, recently the application has resurfaced, with a decision deadline being placed in mid April of this year. It seems for some reason there is now purpose and a desire from the park to having such a request approved.
Coincidentally, last week various aerial images of the Old Town/Logger’s Leap area of Thorpe Park made their way around UK enthusiast circles. These images showed significant tree clearance had occurred over the course of the 2020 season. The cleared area is long, straight, and narrow, and would seemingly be large enough to be part of an out & back coaster layout. GCI have said they have multiple projects ongoing in Europe, and with Wicker Man being a roaring success at Alton Towers with a similar theme already being deployed at Heide Park, who’s to say that Merlin won’t use a tried and tested marketable product at Thorpe Park.
Additionally, with the planning decision due by mid April (presuming a potential 2023 opening for a new attraction, if that is what’s happening) this would give the park time to prepare a planning application for a 2023 project should the April decision be a refusal. (Alton Towers applied for Wicker Man in June 2016 for a March 2018 opening.) While 82ft isn’t very tall, there are other GCI coasters like Prowler that are great rides and are in that height range.
Now, I’m not saying the park are definitely getting a new coaster, and maybe the tree clearance is for another reason, but I am saying that Thorpe wouldn’t spend hundreds of thousands on tree clearance and resurfacing an old planning application for no reason. Plus, the park are long overdue a new coaster and the timing of the two events is suspicious to say the least.
CrashCoaster
CF Legend
@JoshC. is a member on here, so perhaps he could ellaborate. This is very interesting. I think the park deserve better and more considering they wouldn't have got a new coaster in 11 years by 2023, but it will probably be larger than Wicker Man. Thorpe's originally planned GCI in 2009 to have gone where Saw is would have been 88.6ft tall, and Wicker Man is 72ft tall for comparison, if we are assuming this will use up all of the allowed 82ft. Also kind of surprises me that they would consider another GCI, given the fact Wicker Man is literally Europe's Lightning Rod.
roomraider
Best Topic Starter
I didn't think Thorpe Park could build a major loud coaster around loggers leap due to it being the part of the park closest to the nearest housing estate in Chertsey?
Anyway its Thore Park. I've given up all hope and respect for the park and its owners over the last 10 or so years. Fully expecting a tent with a relocated ropes course in it themed somehow to Come Dine With Me.
Anyway its Thore Park. I've given up all hope and respect for the park and its owners over the last 10 or so years. Fully expecting a tent with a relocated ropes course in it themed somehow to Come Dine With Me.
InsomniaMelon
Mega Poster
I’m not sure the local authority would buy the whole “loud noise” complaints for people living near that side of the park (Loggers). There is a motorway in between the park and the nearest housing estate so I’m not sure residents would have a leg to stand on
JoshC.
Strata Poster
Sadly, I think it's currently a case of getting excited over nothing / putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5.
Let's rewind a bit first though. For those unaware, the way Thorpe have been able to putting in planning application for rides over the past couple of decades has been pretty good. The park and the local council have a good relationship, and the council in particular have recognised the value in seeing the park develop (especially when it was expanding).
From 2003ish, the park started submitting Mid Term Development Plans (MTDPs), which outlined rough locations of potential rides and a vague timescale, as well as heights, lengths, buildings, etc. After this was approved, it meant that when the park came to submitting plans for rides, the process was quicker, easier and simpler, since they were just working within pre-approved guidelines.
The thing with the local council though, however, is that when any planning application is submitted, they want to know everything. And the plans have to be followed pretty strictly. And there's also some curiosities that the park have to follow. Some examples of these things:
-Because of the setting, the park can only have a certain amount of indoor space on park (flood risks)
-Fencing, especially those which are close to water, has to have a certain amount of spacing between panels / chain links / etc. This is so that if there is a (admittedly very big) flood, debris won't get caught in fencing
-Care has to be taken with the lake and the number, and location of, any ride supports
-The standard noise / height considerations which many parks have to think about
The last MTDP the park submitted was around 2009/10, and that covered a time period up to 2016. Those plans highlighted potential flat ride locations and 2 potential locations, in 3 potential locations (1 ended up being Swarm, the other locations were the island behind Swarm, and the area where the Shark Hotel now stands). A dark ride was not mentioned there. When the park decided to go down the DBGT route, they had to submit a full planning application, as opposed to one covered by the MTDP. It requires a bit more work and is considered a bit longer, but it's not an issue really, and the application went through fine.
As mentioned, no MTDP was submitted for post-2016, and 2017 was this new application submitted...
What is the 2017 application about?
As MakoMania said, it sought for the park to be able to build buildings (as long as they're under 5m tall) and build new rides (as long as they're under 25m tall), and make modifications to existing ones. It just means the resort doesn't need to put in an application to the council. So whereas in the past, we saw applications for everything from Rush to another extension of the Pizza Pasta building, to the theming feature and new queueline when Walking Dead The Ride opened, if approved, we wouldn't see those things. They would still be under the same strict rules I mentioned earlier, but there would be an understanding and expectation these were followed, of course.
However, the application did not cover roller coasters (which would still need to have full planning applications submitted). We would also see plans if the park wanted to change the agreed upon rules (ie: if they wanted more than their current maximum allowance of building space).
What happened with the application?
In short, nothing. I'm not quite sure what the story is here to be honest. But basically, no decision was ever formalised by the council. In terms of paperwork we have access to: this application was submitted in Autumn 2017, and an objection from a resident was filed in July 2019. And then last November, a document appeared highlighting an Extension of Time until April 2021 regarding the proposal. What does that actually mean? I don't know.
From what I've been told, the council had a certain amount of reluctance to approve the application. But why a decision was never made I don't know. Maybe there's a certain amount of time they have to give a decision by (3 years sounds like a sensible vague arbitrary deadline?), and they've extended the time for which a decision should be made? Or maybe the powers at Thorpe/Merlin are pushing for a decision? Or maybe something else?
tl;dr - I don't have a bloody clue here. Anyone with more (read: any) knowledge of UK planning laws might have more insight here?
Other Stuff
Is this why Thorpe haven't built anything recently?
I'm sure someone will start coming up with a clutching-at-straws conspiracy theory that this is the reason why Thorpe haven't built anything recently. So to nip that in the bud: if the park wanted to, I don't so any reason why they couldn't submit a planning application whilst waiting for a decision. They did it with Walking Dead, and with a Pizza Pasta extension. They could do it with a ride.
The Trees
I can't remember if this has been discussed elsewhere here. But if it hasn't, here's the pictures:
(Both pictures from Jack Silkstone, with the latter sourced from Google Earth I believe)
Anyone who did Platform 15 during Fright Nights last year, and is familiar with the surroundings, might have noticed that some trees were gone. I've got no clue why they were cut. My two potential, sensible, thoughts are:
1. Because the trees are by Platform 15, they have to be inspected yearly, and some were found to be rotting/dying/at risk of falling, so needed chopping for the route to be safe.
2. The Creek Freaks Unchained scare zone featured lots of chopped up wood that was used for theming. Maybe Thorpe just cut down some trees away from the park to get some theming? (Also possible coupled in with the above point)
I believe Jack posted a video discussing this (with a clickbaity "New coaster at THORPE PARK?!?!" title), and said that staff have told him it's nothing to do with a new ride. So feel free to take that at face value too.
As I say, I've no clue what the reason could be though. And I do grant you that it's a lot of trees in a very specific layout. But for now, it's a mystery to me.
Noise and Ride Locations
Yes and no.
Here's a screenshot from the 2017 application the park made:
The pink line is their development zone, ie: where any attractions can take place in theory.
It's a bit beyond the Platform 15 / old train route. So in theory, they can apply to build whatever they like there. And indeed, long before Saw happened, one plan considered was to have a coaster interact with Loggers around that park of the park.
However, I think there were some concerns after Saw about the noise it created, as the sound very much carries (especially when there's wind). I know there were some complaints shortly after it opened, but nothing major. And as someone who's lived in Chertsey in the past, I can confirm you can sometimes hear the park from beyond the motorway.
Whilst I'm not aware of any documentation about it, I do believe there was an agreement of sorts that the park wouldn't build a thrill ride any closer to Chertsey beyond where Saw currently is. Obviously that was a long time ago, and it's possible that people (both sides of the agreement) have left their respective parties, so it might mean nothing now. And also at the time, I doubt Thorpe foresaw Loggers closing any time soon, so there's that...
tl;dr - If theory, they could build a thrill ride there, but it seems unlikely.
Anyway, I've waffled on enough. Some cut-down trees is one of the most exciting developments at Thorpe for us as enthusiasts in almost 5 years (a rather sad statement to write), but it probably means nothing. The boring documents on the council website probably mean nothing too. But hey, we'll see...
Let's rewind a bit first though. For those unaware, the way Thorpe have been able to putting in planning application for rides over the past couple of decades has been pretty good. The park and the local council have a good relationship, and the council in particular have recognised the value in seeing the park develop (especially when it was expanding).
From 2003ish, the park started submitting Mid Term Development Plans (MTDPs), which outlined rough locations of potential rides and a vague timescale, as well as heights, lengths, buildings, etc. After this was approved, it meant that when the park came to submitting plans for rides, the process was quicker, easier and simpler, since they were just working within pre-approved guidelines.
The thing with the local council though, however, is that when any planning application is submitted, they want to know everything. And the plans have to be followed pretty strictly. And there's also some curiosities that the park have to follow. Some examples of these things:
-Because of the setting, the park can only have a certain amount of indoor space on park (flood risks)
-Fencing, especially those which are close to water, has to have a certain amount of spacing between panels / chain links / etc. This is so that if there is a (admittedly very big) flood, debris won't get caught in fencing
-Care has to be taken with the lake and the number, and location of, any ride supports
-The standard noise / height considerations which many parks have to think about
The last MTDP the park submitted was around 2009/10, and that covered a time period up to 2016. Those plans highlighted potential flat ride locations and 2 potential locations, in 3 potential locations (1 ended up being Swarm, the other locations were the island behind Swarm, and the area where the Shark Hotel now stands). A dark ride was not mentioned there. When the park decided to go down the DBGT route, they had to submit a full planning application, as opposed to one covered by the MTDP. It requires a bit more work and is considered a bit longer, but it's not an issue really, and the application went through fine.
As mentioned, no MTDP was submitted for post-2016, and 2017 was this new application submitted...
What is the 2017 application about?
As MakoMania said, it sought for the park to be able to build buildings (as long as they're under 5m tall) and build new rides (as long as they're under 25m tall), and make modifications to existing ones. It just means the resort doesn't need to put in an application to the council. So whereas in the past, we saw applications for everything from Rush to another extension of the Pizza Pasta building, to the theming feature and new queueline when Walking Dead The Ride opened, if approved, we wouldn't see those things. They would still be under the same strict rules I mentioned earlier, but there would be an understanding and expectation these were followed, of course.
However, the application did not cover roller coasters (which would still need to have full planning applications submitted). We would also see plans if the park wanted to change the agreed upon rules (ie: if they wanted more than their current maximum allowance of building space).
What happened with the application?
In short, nothing. I'm not quite sure what the story is here to be honest. But basically, no decision was ever formalised by the council. In terms of paperwork we have access to: this application was submitted in Autumn 2017, and an objection from a resident was filed in July 2019. And then last November, a document appeared highlighting an Extension of Time until April 2021 regarding the proposal. What does that actually mean? I don't know.
From what I've been told, the council had a certain amount of reluctance to approve the application. But why a decision was never made I don't know. Maybe there's a certain amount of time they have to give a decision by (3 years sounds like a sensible vague arbitrary deadline?), and they've extended the time for which a decision should be made? Or maybe the powers at Thorpe/Merlin are pushing for a decision? Or maybe something else?
tl;dr - I don't have a bloody clue here. Anyone with more (read: any) knowledge of UK planning laws might have more insight here?
Other Stuff
Is this why Thorpe haven't built anything recently?
I'm sure someone will start coming up with a clutching-at-straws conspiracy theory that this is the reason why Thorpe haven't built anything recently. So to nip that in the bud: if the park wanted to, I don't so any reason why they couldn't submit a planning application whilst waiting for a decision. They did it with Walking Dead, and with a Pizza Pasta extension. They could do it with a ride.
The Trees
I can't remember if this has been discussed elsewhere here. But if it hasn't, here's the pictures:
(Both pictures from Jack Silkstone, with the latter sourced from Google Earth I believe)
Anyone who did Platform 15 during Fright Nights last year, and is familiar with the surroundings, might have noticed that some trees were gone. I've got no clue why they were cut. My two potential, sensible, thoughts are:
1. Because the trees are by Platform 15, they have to be inspected yearly, and some were found to be rotting/dying/at risk of falling, so needed chopping for the route to be safe.
2. The Creek Freaks Unchained scare zone featured lots of chopped up wood that was used for theming. Maybe Thorpe just cut down some trees away from the park to get some theming? (Also possible coupled in with the above point)
I believe Jack posted a video discussing this (with a clickbaity "New coaster at THORPE PARK?!?!" title), and said that staff have told him it's nothing to do with a new ride. So feel free to take that at face value too.
As I say, I've no clue what the reason could be though. And I do grant you that it's a lot of trees in a very specific layout. But for now, it's a mystery to me.
Noise and Ride Locations
Yes and no.
Here's a screenshot from the 2017 application the park made:
The pink line is their development zone, ie: where any attractions can take place in theory.
It's a bit beyond the Platform 15 / old train route. So in theory, they can apply to build whatever they like there. And indeed, long before Saw happened, one plan considered was to have a coaster interact with Loggers around that park of the park.
However, I think there were some concerns after Saw about the noise it created, as the sound very much carries (especially when there's wind). I know there were some complaints shortly after it opened, but nothing major. And as someone who's lived in Chertsey in the past, I can confirm you can sometimes hear the park from beyond the motorway.
Whilst I'm not aware of any documentation about it, I do believe there was an agreement of sorts that the park wouldn't build a thrill ride any closer to Chertsey beyond where Saw currently is. Obviously that was a long time ago, and it's possible that people (both sides of the agreement) have left their respective parties, so it might mean nothing now. And also at the time, I doubt Thorpe foresaw Loggers closing any time soon, so there's that...
tl;dr - If theory, they could build a thrill ride there, but it seems unlikely.
Anyway, I've waffled on enough. Some cut-down trees is one of the most exciting developments at Thorpe for us as enthusiasts in almost 5 years (a rather sad statement to write), but it probably means nothing. The boring documents on the council website probably mean nothing too. But hey, we'll see...
Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
At the end of this season it will be a decade since the park has added anything interesting/of value to the park. I’d love to see them change that, but honestly now I’ve just written the park off.
So, now that @JoshC. has cleared up the confusion, I think we can lock this thread and let it bubble back to its slumber at the depths of the forum. There is a much more recent thread discussing developments at Thorpe Park here, in case anybody has anything else to say about the place:
coasterforce.com
What is going on with Thorpe park?
I’m not sure if the horror themes is it, as Alton Towers has done a very similar thing for years and remains successful. I think it could have something to do with Thorpe’s lack of family appeal, however; the key difference between Thorpe and Alton is that despite the fact that both parks...
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