What's new

Whiting out on Nemesis and Nemesis Inferno...

Have you ever whited/blacked out or felt like you might on...

  • Nemesis

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Nemesis Inferno

    Votes: 1 100.0%
  • Both

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    1
A

Anonymous

Guest
HAJiME said:
It COULD be heat related, but can you prove that?
It's simple logic that the hotter a person is the more... whats the word... well, worked up they get.

Doesn't heat increase blood pressure...?

Well anyway. When it's hot, i know i' more prone to headaches, etc... And people often faint under intense heat. So it's only logical that ehat would effect the riders...

But... this is England. lol. Their are coasters in far hotter climates with higher G-forces than Nemesis Inferno.

But thats just your own reasoning, got any scientific proof?

HAJiME said:
So basically, there is a scientific way to prove something like a white out, if it exists.
I do understand what you're saying, but the way you're saying it sounds daft...

Look. Ever suffered from a headache? How can you proove that headaches exist...? Hm? Can you proove it..? NO! But it still happens.

If i feel faint, appear to 'out' and i see white... i'm gunna call it a ....white out! Cuz' the English language is amazing like that, ya know.

How can you not understand what im saying? If it exists, you would think that because coasters are suppsosed to be as safe as possible, there would be research done for something like what you are saying, right? So find that research somewhere and show it to us. Im not saying you are wrong, I just want to see some evidence.

Yes, I have suffered from a headache, and yes I can prove headaches exist. You would be suprized how many things have actually been proven scientifically, unlike 'whiting out'. Heres how headaches work.

It seems like you are trying to keep from finding any proof at all, since you keep trying to give (bad) examples of stuff that hasnt been proven, but we all know exists. So you are saying white outs are the same way with proof, which is makes it so you dont have to find any proof whatsoever. I wont be happy till you show some proof, so dont try that.
 

SaiyanHajime

CF Legend
...White otus obviously arn't hurting anyone. It's not like a serious black out, it's just dizzyness caused by dissorientation liek Kir said ont he first page.

But thats just your own reasoning, got any scientific proof?
Does somthing so obvious need any proof? I'd hope not.

http://www.comportone.com/cpo/health/articles/heat.htm

Heat Fainting
- is a quick drop in blood pressure that can lead to fainting.
HEAT CAUSES HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE.

Heat-Stress
...wow, i thought i was the only one...

But i know for a fact that in hot weather i feel more stressed out and i'm frustrated easier... But, i am at room temprature, also. :p

Like anything, if the human body overheats it's a bad thing.

http://my.webmd.com/hw/health_guide_atoz/not245139.asp

Heat syncope (fainting)


Heat syncope occurs when you faint suddenly and lose consciousness because of low blood pressure. Heat causes the blood vessels to expand (dilate), so body fluid moves into the legs by gravity, which causes low blood pressure and may result in fainting.

..And aprently, one of the symtoms is 'feeling faint or lightheaded', somthing experianced in white outs.

These ae of coruse from extreme cases, but could help to explain some stuff.

EDIT:

Google rocks...

http://www.ejectionsite.com/stapp.htm

Blood was rapidly leaving his eyeballs and pooling towards the back of his head in response to gravity, resulting in a "white out."

..Again, extreme... but may have somthing to do with all this.


Acording to dictionary.com, a 'white-out' is to do with weather.... It appears a 'white-out' is (as far as a word definition is concerned) loss of vision due to extreme weather. But that doesn't mean that what we're talking about doesn't exist... before any dumbass says that.


..urbandictionary.com had some interestign stuff to say, including;

1) A sevear blizzard where nothing but snow is visable.
2) A brand of correction fluid
3) To overdose on Cocaine
4) To ejaculate into your own or your partners eye


...So yeah.. ok, these thigns obviously arn't traditionally called 'white-outs' very often.




WAIT FOR IT! ..Stop smirking, JOEY'S GOT SOMTHING!

I foudn one site that said a white-out is the opposite to a black-out, which sounds logical....

http://www.cart-racing.com/features/2003/item_159.html

vision started to get narrow, which is what happens when you blackout. When you blackout, the blood that?s in your brain just goes down your body and then you just blackout. If you whiteout, it?s opposite, the blood goes up and you lose consciousness

Black out the blood goes down, white out the blood goes up... Sounds logical to me.

And a definition from the 'Pilots glossery....'

http://www.voodoo.cz/falcon/glossary.html

Whiteout - The inability to distinguish colors during the initial stages of a blackout.

...also sounds feisable.


*cough* Do i really need to continue?

White-out do exist... Just like everything there is more than one definition for this word. But they do have somthing to do with blood pressure, meaning that heat could cause one, and they do have somthign to do with g-forces.

Special thanks to google for makign it all possible... Don't make me do that again, my browser will never forgive me.
 

Infernus

Hyper Poster
Thats annoying.. theres no choice for never...

I completely agree with Joey.. it is possible to be both blacked out and whited out.. as i have seen on many occasions while riding N:I.. i have heard people next to me saying they thought they were going to die because they saw a white light.. or.. it just went dark and silent.. next thing i know we're in the brake run.
 

Angel

Hyper Poster
Well i think you've proved your point there!

For you guys in america ... if you aint ridden it how do you really know what its like?

Each coaster is one to itself ... even with clones etc. Yes Nemesis is intense but believe me of recent N:I is packing a real punch!
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Thank you, finally. Thats ALL I wanted. The only issue I have is where you said that its logical that a white out is the opposite of a black out, which its not, that would be a red out. The best description of a white out that you found was probably the last one, which would make sense.
 

SaiyanHajime

CF Legend
The only issue I have is where you said that its logical that a white out is the opposite of a black out, which its not, that would be a red out.
Well thats what i was just thinking, which is why i returned to the topic. But i've just thought of somthing.

...You think that perhaps it's possible that blood rushing to the head causes a 'red out' and that as the blood dispurses again, the rider may see white.... causing a white out?

Of coruse, depending on the person in question, they may not actually see the red or white... or either. It would depend on the intensity of incident and the person themselves.

Maybe these 'white outs' people are experiancing on inferno are the after effect of blood rushing to the head. As the blood pressure returns to normal.

...just a thought.
 

kir

Hyper Poster
But I'm sure you don't get red outs unless you're facing forces way more than any ride offers. It's when the blood pools behind your eyes. I'm sure white outs are different, as when I've seen white, it's just white stars against a fuzzy background!
 

SaiyanHajime

CF Legend
...what i ment Kir, is that what if whiting out was the after effect of a weak red-out that you may not visually notice.
 

Paul

Roller Poster
^^Exactly. Red outs are very rare on coasters, as airtime is usually for too short of a period of time for all the blood to expand the blood vessels in your brain, in order for you to see red.

However, going back to the last page, the one source Joey posted was incorrect about white-outs. They aren't the opposite of blackouts, otherwise it would be impossible to experience one on Nemesis: Inferno, since the lowest g force on it is 0, in the zero-g roll. Also, you said that the feeling was gone as you went into the zero-g roll, further proving the point that it had to do with positive g forces.

And yes, Nemesis: Inferno does pull the highest g force of any B&M Inverted coaster in the UK, at 4.5. While I did notice that a few British sites claim Nemesis to pull 4 g's, rcdb and a few more reliable sites say both 3 g's and 3.5 g's...so I'll go with rcdb, as I know it to be the most accurate. However, if anyone has ever seen/found a G-Force Analysis Chart for Nemesis, I'd be happy if you posted a link to it on the forums so I could have a look at it.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Well here's one...

When my dad starting having an allergic reaction to fire ants, his vision starting going and he started seeing white.

When I had a bad headache once, I started seeing whiteness and blurriness.

It's just something that happens to some people at some times.
 

SaiyanHajime

CF Legend
However, going back to the last page, the one source Joey posted was incorrect about white-outs.
"Blah blah blah, those websites where written by professionals and they are wrong, blah blah, i'm onyl 15 and yet i know everything, blaaah..."

While I did notice that a few British sites claim Nemesis to pull 4 g's, rcdb and a few more reliable sites say both 3 g's and 3.5 g's...so I'll go with rcdb, as I know it to be the most accurate.
"...And the sites i look at are 100% correct! Blaaah! Because they told me so! Yours are wrong and mine are right.. blah blah blah."

Are you that f*ckin' stoopid?! SERIOUSLY!?

Yeah, the sites i find are automatically talking bullsh*t, but the ones you look at are all 100% accurate! Yeah, ok... whatever.

few British sites
Wait, wait... "British" sites?

few more reliable
...more reliable American sites perhaps? Ya know, because we Brit's get everything wrong and can't measure g-forces.


Take you're little "my penis is bigger than yours!" argument elsewhere dude, or... "i'll get my daddy on you!"


Somone better lock this.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
very good joey... *pet pet* its clear to see who's the interlectual one round here and how's the imature... "i'm better then you" person. but please... no bitching on the forums, if any arguments like this arise it only takes one person to come along and tell everyone that joey's right.

and he is right... nemesis will pull 4G but not always, like any rolercoaster running on gravertational propultion technology the is a fine balance between several variable factors suck as friction, wind resistance, wind velocity, weight of the load (passengers) and thermal conditions.. which means that is can pull as little as 3 G and as much as 5 depending on when you measure it so why are you argueing!!!!
 

Paul

Roller Poster
HAJiME said:
However, going back to the last page, the one source Joey posted was incorrect about white-outs.
"Blah blah blah, those websites where written by professionals and they are wrong, blah blah, i'm onyl 15 and yet i know everything, blaaah..."

Don't you realise why the website is wrong? They said "white-outs" are the exact opposite of black-outs. Black-outs occur during times of high positive g-force. That would mean, in that website's description, that white-outs occur during times of high negative g-forces. Now, you yourself stated in this very topic that the sensation ceased to exist as the train started to enter the zero-g roll. Because there is no area in a vertical loop where negative g-forces occur, that site is clearly wrong, or at least is wrong by your white-out experience.

The following pictures come from the professionally-created coaster "Montu" in NoLimits, created by Ole Lange himself. The photos are from 5 points in the vertical loop. Please note the vertical g-forces in each five points of the loop:

Going into loop: +4.9g
montu19gr.jpg


Reaching vertical angle in loop (90 degrees): +3.9g
montu27nc.jpg


At point of inversion in loop (180 degrees): +1.5g
montu34od.jpg


Reaching 2nd vertical angle in loop (90 degrees): +1.9g
montu48vt.jpg


Coming out of vertical loop: +4.2g
montu57xr.jpg


As you can see, the lowest point of g force in the vertical loop, or in any vertical loop, is when the train is inverted. If the train was parked at a halt at the apex of the loop, although upside-down; the g force of the train would be 1g. However, because the train needs velocity to make it around the loop without stopping at the apex or rolling back; the force exerted upon the riders will always be somewhere above 1g; depending on the speed of the train. As the speed of the train increases, the g force exerted upon the riders in the loop also increases.

However, you did not say exactly where between the train leaving the lift hill and entering the zero-g roll you experienced the white out, so there's one more thing to analyze.

After reaching the top of the lift hill, Nemesis: Inferno goes down what is defined as a "drop". A drop is defined as any decrease in elevation made by an object. If Nemesis: Inferno had a perfectly vertical (90-degree) drop, and friction were no factor; riders on Nemesis: Inferno would experience a g force of zero, which is the minimum g force that it is possible to create during any type of freefall. If you are experiencing 0 g's; your blood would neither be forced up nor down, because there would be no force on it at all.

The human body, however, cannot survive during prolonged periods of time at zero g's, because zero g's make it difficult for diffusion and active transport between cells to take place, upsetting homeostasis. This is the reason people that travel into Space have to wear protective clothing. However, problems with this condition cannot happen during a time of zero g's on a coaster, because it takes at least a few hours before it starts to negatively effect the human body at all.

However, because Nemesis: Inferno's drop is not perfectly vertical, and because friction exists on earth, riders experience at least some positive g force on all drops.

And, as you know, after the dive drop, the train on Nemesis: Inferno enters the vertical loop, which forces have already been explained above. Then, the zero-g roll immediately follows the vertical loop, which is where you mentioned previously that the sensation of "white-out" ceased.

So, as you can now see, there is no instance of negative g-force at any time between the time the train comes off the lift hill, and the time the train is about to enter the zero-g roll. Therefore, in your explanation of your white-out experience, the site which you provided a link to has an incorrect definition of white-out, at least in your case.

HAJiME said:
Paul said:
While I did notice that a few British sites claim Nemesis to pull 4 g's, rcdb and a few more reliable sites say both 3 g's and 3.5 g's...so I'll go with rcdb, as I know it to be the most accurate.

And the sites i look at are 100% correct! Blaaah! Because they told me so! Yours are wrong and mine are right.. blah blah blah."

Are you that f*ckin' stoopid?! SERIOUSLY!?

Yeah, the sites i find are automatically talking bullsh*t, but the ones you look at are all 100% accurate! Yeah, ok... whatever.

Paul said:
few British sites

Wait, wait... "British" sites?

Actually, it makes perfect sense that I went to British sites to check the g force of Nemesis, because I'm not sure if you realize this, but Nemesis can be found in Great Britain. I'm not saying just British sites are wrong, because even Towers Times; the unofficial guide to Alton Towers, lists Nemesis as having 3.5 g's. CoasterForce lists Nemesis as having 4 g's, and rcdb lists Nemesis as having 3 g's. However, I said 3 g's in my post because I checked rcdb ahead of time. If you haven't heard of it, I recommend you check the site out. Here is a link to rcdb. I think that the majority of enthusiasts both on this site and others would consider rcdb to be one of the most accurate resorces for roller coasters available. Therefore, I find it acceptable that I posted 3 g's after checking an extremely reliable source.

Oh and to answer your question, I'm don't think I'm f*ckin "stoopid", because I picked up my dictionary just now, and failed to find a word called "stoopid" in the English language. Did you perhaps spell that word incorrectly? If so, please look up and post the correct spelling, and I will search for the definition, and inform you whether I attain to the definition of the word or not.

However, I will also say that the British do many, many things right. William Shakespeare was one of the greatest writers to ever exist, and he was British. Great Britain is also one of the most powerful nations of the world. I never said anywhere that Americans were better at anything than Britons.

Now, please feel free to bash and question parts of this post you'd like an explanation to, as I know you will. Also rest assured that I will gladly answer any questions you have, give more proof of anything if you'd like it, or correct anything you say that is wrong.

Oh, and in closing; my penis is bigger than yours.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Actually, thats a pretty crappy rec of Montu. There are better user made recreations elsewhere. And last time I checked, penis size wasn't a factor for blacking/whiting/redding/yellowing/etc... out.

Stop whining about info you find on the internet. There will always be different info on it for the same thing...
 

Paul

Roller Poster
^It may be a crappy rec of Montu, but I was only using it for the vertical loop to prove for g force purposes, which is an accurate vertical loop. And the penis thing was only because of what he said.

And I wasn't "whining" about internet info, just proving why the site he provided was incorrect and irrelevant.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Paul said:
While I did notice that a few British sites claim Nemesis to pull 4 g's, rcdb and a few more reliable sites say both 3 g's and 3.5 g's...so I'll go with rcdb, as I know it to be the most accurate.

Great, your sources are so reliable that they don't correlate, "3g or 3.5g" so a 17% margin of error. Your sites don't even agree with themselves. Nice.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
My penis is bigger than all of yours are.
Oh...it's on.

Uh...and to stay on topic...dictionary.com doesn't have a definition of "whiteout" that goes with this instance.
 

Ben

CF Legend
In fact, the offical G-force stated by Alton Towers for Nemesis is 4gs and if anyone would know, it's them.
 

SaiyanHajime

CF Legend
Uh...and to stay on topic...dictionary.com doesn't have a definition of "whiteout" that goes with this instance.
I USED A BLOODY HYPHEN.

However, you did not say exactly where between the train leaving the lift hill and entering the zero-g roll you experienced the white out, so there's one more thing to analyze.
I don't expect you to read all of all my posts... but when i've wrote it at least 3 times...

...I feel like im going to go every time i ride Inferno now, but it's rarly worse than a few white splodges around the side of my eyes at the base of the loop and dissapears over the zero-g.

The strange experiance often starts at the top of the loop and my vision starts to go at the base of it.

My vision faded in from the edges and i felt dizzy exiting the loop...

...

I picked up my dictionary just now, and failed to find a word called "stoopid" in the English language.
I type like i speak... adds a bit of, hmm, lets say 'umph' to my posts. If i want to emphasise a word, i spell it how it would sound... I.E 'Stoopid', an exagerated version of the commonly used word 'stupid.'

...Understand now?

Sorry, i didn't realise you couldn't pronounce 'new' words.

And I wasn't "whining" about internet info, just proving why the site he provided was incorrect and irrelevant.
It's just as valid as you're websites.

*cough..*

"Ethics and codes of conduct in ICT:

Rules which all members should endevsour to discharge in pursuing their professional lives...
"

These ethics and codes of conduct are irelevent to the internet, becuase it is impossible to make rules on the internet.

While child pornography is illegal, its impossible to stop on the intetnet.

..It's the same with information on the net. Wrong information cannot be prevented from getting onto the web.

You can make a webpage about whatever you like, no matter how wrong it is.

THUS NEITHER OF OUR SOURCES ARE ANY MORE ACCURATE.

...so I'll go with rcdb, as I know it to be the most accurate.
Because RCDB are the gods of the internet world and they know everyhting...!

...How the hell do you know that?
 
Top