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Thorpe Park | Derren Brown's Ghost Train | VR Attraction

Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Disagree Darren, whilst in the short term that business model will work for them, in the long term it's doomed to fail because they're restricted by both space and height. Whilst I don't think a giant dark ride is the answer, and another coaster is exactly what they need, I don't think it should be a continuous thing moving forward.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Mysterious Sue said:
It's Thorpe's maintenance issues. Dark rides need constant attention, upkeep and money. If they can't be bothered to paint Colossus every few years how on earth will a dark ride not end up a big pile of crap after 3 or 4 years.
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^ Agreed. But I'm thinking this dark ride will consist of screens rather than set pieces, which are *hopefully* easier to maintain..?

After the drop in attendance figures after Swarm, I think it's logical that Thorpe are re-thinking the whole 'adult theme park' brand. Aiming for a target audience of families with older children is good because:

1. Older children will still have to pay the 12yrs+ adult entry fee
2. It still distinguishes the park from Legoland (for kids aged 4 - 8yrs) and Chessington (for kids aged 9 - 11yrs)

It's reasonable to assume that a family of 4 will have more disposable income to spend in the park than teenage chavs (they've already spent their money on weed to smoke in the queue)

After the success of Harry Potter and The Forbidden Journey, why wouldn't one of the UK's major parks want to follow suit and build a similar dark ride with another popular I.P.? A dark ride themed to Doctor Who would already have a established, receptive audience, that could be much wider than the appeal of a new coaster.

If Swarm demonstrates anything, it's that big coasters don't always get it right with the public. I would much rather Thorpe try to build something different first, than just slapped down another mediocre big ride.

The recent steps they have taken -turning X://Let Me Off into X://Fab Disco Ride, and sprucing the bare, drab walkways of Amity into Angry Birds Land; are an improvement in my opinion.

Plus, the UK don't have any decent dark rides near the scale of Spiderman for example; if Thorpe manage to build a good one they will have something that makes the park stand out in the UK, and will feel like a new type of ride experience to a lot of guests.

I'm all for a dark ride at Thorpe...(as long as they build a hyper afterwards :wink: )
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Smithy said:
Disagree Darren, whilst in the short term that business model will work for them, in the long term it's doomed to fail because they're restricted by both space and height. Whilst I don't think a giant dark ride is the answer, and another coaster is exactly what they need, I don't think it should be a continuous thing moving forward.
Click to expand...

I agree to an extent, but, it's doable. Thorpe realistically only need a woodie and a hyper to complete a damn good set of coasters. A woodie and a Hyper would fit within their current parameters. The woodie on the island and the hyper across the back of the park or out into the car park and back.

Then they have to be clever and work with the space they've got, which is simple enough. Especially when you think that the arena is wasted space, no way out is also a prime spot along with slammer for a future large scale attraction. Then add the whole area that depth charge sits in, there really is huge room for expansion.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Just to clarify. Legoland is for 2-12 year olds, working for legoland myself I have found out the clientele is of course children and maybe crazy adults that love Lego. Chessington World Of Adventures is for 5-15 years old the difference is that now Thorpe are going to become a family park it feels strange. They don't really have many kids attraction.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

jj23w said:
They don't really have many kids attraction.
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And that's exactly why they should build a family dark ride!

But I also think you're forgetting that a lot of kids aged 10+ love big coasters. When my family visited Alton Towers once a year, it was all about Nemesis, Corkscrew ..etc. So it's odd to say Thorpe Park has no potential family appeal, I think a lot of families with 1.4m kids appreciate going on big rides together there.

Plus: Logger's Leap, Storm in a Tea Cup, Rapids, Banana Boat, X, Depth Charge, Flying Fish, Carousel, Storm Surge, Tidal Wave, Angry Birds Dodge Thems, Angry Birds Cinema, Rocky Express, Quantum... hardly a shortage of tame family rides, is it.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

If Thorpe wants family in a compact space, I think a GCI is the answer. They're compact, fun, and if done right- can be fun for the whole family!

Also, the UK GP needs to get over it's fear of woodies. It's kinda ridiculous.

Sent from my VS840 4G using Tapatalk
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Darren B said:
Smithy said:
Disagree Darren, whilst in the short term that business model will work for them, in the long term it's doomed to fail because they're restricted by both space and height. Whilst I don't think a giant dark ride is the answer, and another coaster is exactly what they need, I don't think it should be a continuous thing moving forward.
Click to expand...

I agree to an extent, but, it's doable. Thorpe realistically only need a woodie and a hyper to complete a damn good set of coasters. A woodie and a Hyper would fit within their current parameters. The woodie on the island and the hyper across the back of the park or out into the car park and back.

Then they have to be clever and work with the space they've got, which is simple enough. Especially when you think that the arena is wasted space, no way out is also a prime spot along with slammer for a future large scale attraction. Then add the whole area that depth charge sits in, there really is huge room for expansion.
Click to expand...

Oh aye it's doable in the short-to-mid-term scheme of things. But then what? If their target market becomes accustomed to new coasters every few years, there's only so much space they have to work with before they have to start removing rides and that'd probably mean coasters and increased cost. Knowing Merlin I don't think they'd want to commit to such an investment heavy business model.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Smithy said:
Darren B said:
Smithy said:
Disagree Darren, whilst in the short term that business model will work for them, in the long term it's doomed to fail because they're restricted by both space and height. Whilst I don't think a giant dark ride is the answer, and another coaster is exactly what they need, I don't think it should be a continuous thing moving forward.
Click to expand...

I agree to an extent, but, it's doable. Thorpe realistically only need a woodie and a hyper to complete a damn good set of coasters. A woodie and a Hyper would fit within their current parameters. The woodie on the island and the hyper across the back of the park or out into the car park and back.

Then they have to be clever and work with the space they've got, which is simple enough. Especially when you think that the arena is wasted space, no way out is also a prime spot along with slammer for a future large scale attraction. Then add the whole area that depth charge sits in, there really is huge room for expansion.
Click to expand...

Oh aye it's doable in the short-to-mid-term scheme of things. But then what? If their target market becomes accustomed to new coasters every few years, there's only so much space they have to work with before they have to start removing rides and that'd probably mean coasters and increased cost. Knowing Merlin I don't think they'd want to commit to such an investment heavy business model.
Click to expand...

That, and Merlin realised that the sole thrill market wasn't bringing in the money... Not that changing to the family market this year has helped mind, probably because the park still has that sort of reputation after years of telling families to not bother coming...
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Everyone seems to be missing the vital point as to why Thorpe Park isn't faring too well in their quest to become a thrill park - Since 2006 they haven't built a decent coaster. That's the problem.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Darren B said:
Everyone seems to be missing the vital point as to why Thorpe Park isn't faring too well in their quest to become a thrill park - Since 2006 they haven't built a decent coaster. That's the problem.
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Because they are in the process of changing their target market, they are now aiming for a "first thrill" audience after alienating this group for so long by only building thrill rides. This is also part of the re branding the park with the tag line "An island like no other".
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

^You missed my point dear, I'm not going on about now, I'm talking about how Thorpe didn't help themselves by building mediocre coasters during their 'thrill' park years.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

^Sorry about that dear, it wasn't immediately clear as the wording was rather ambiguous due to the fact you put become. Since they aren't looking to do this anymore I wrongly made my assumption.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Ready_23 said:
^Sorry about that dear, it wasn't immediately clear as the wording was rather ambiguous.
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That's fine babes, I was typing whilst having a turf out at work which has lead to my poor deliverance, please forgive me :D

But we got there in the end, Saw & Stealth were both bad decisions in terms of ride type. The theming is great, but the rides fail to deliver to the highest standard. If you want repeat customers you've got to give them a reason to keep coming back.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Whilst they might not be up to your standards, those two rides did boost the numbers visiting the park. This was similar to when collosus was built.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Darren B said:
Everyone seems to be missing the vital point as to why Thorpe Park isn't faring too well in their quest to become a thrill park - Since 2006 they haven't built a decent coaster. That's the problem.
Click to expand...

It wasn't that the park was failing to be a thrill park, it's that the park was just not bringing the returns Merlin wanted/expected (I would say that it failing is too strong a term)... This is of course as a result that those guests who visit a thrill orientated park tend to not have the disposable income that comes readily to families, who will happily fork over that month's wage packet for Timmy's new Mickey plush...

I liken it to when Magic Mountain suddenly (after Six Flags were losing money hand over fist) went into the family market in a desperate attempt to get the money flooding in, even though it had alienated that audience for years and was also against one of the biggest competitors in the family park market in Disney...

Unfortunately for Thorpe, the teen/thrill market that they ended up being pointed into did not bring the overheads wanted by the big-wigs at Merlin HQ... Hence why they blamed Swarm for the park's poor performance in 2012... Hence the sudden rebrand (a positive, the old branding was ****), and the urge to get the family market in through Angry Birds Land...

This apparently hasn't seemingly worked for them though, so it's back to the drawing board and apparently a bigger IP is what's required; rather than say, tarting up the park, making it presentable AND enjoyable for anyone not buying a Fastrack, investing it filler attractions beyond spinning or roller coasters and really taking a long hard think as to why the park isn't being the juggernaught they want it to be, etc, etc, etc...
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

A new coaster will always boost attendance, they could build a Vekoma Boomerang and it'd increase numbers.

What I'm talking about is building something amazing and iconic that will drive repeat customers. I'll post a few examples below that have completely changed the fortunes of a park based on 1 coaster;

EGF - Holiday Park
Troy - Toverland
Big One - Blackpool
Nemesis - Alton Towers
Stealth - Thorpe Park
Collosos - Heide Park
Katun - Miribilandia
Piraten - Djurs

I could actually go on for a while. Most of the above are world class coasters thst have shaped the park into the success it is now. That's what Thorpe need now they're in decline, that 1 coaster that will engage the masses once again. They need another Stealth.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Nemesis Inferno said:
Darren B said:
Everyone seems to be missing the vital point as to why Thorpe Park isn't faring too well in their quest to become a thrill park - Since 2006 they haven't built a decent coaster. That's the problem.
Click to expand...

It wasn't that the park was failing to be a thrill park, it's that the park was just not bringing the returns Merlin wanted/expected (I would say that it failing is too strong a term)... This is of course as a result that those guests who visit a thrill orientated park tend to not have the disposable income that comes readily to families, who will happily fork over that month's wage packet for Timmy's new Mickey plush...

I liken it to when Magic Mountain suddenly (after Six Flags were losing money hand over fist) went into the family market in a desperate attempt to get the money flooding in, even though it had alienated that audience for years and was also against one of the biggest competitors in the family park market in Disney...

Unfortunately for Thorpe, the teen/thrill market that they ended up being pointed into did not bring the overheads wanted by the big-wigs at Merlin HQ... Hence why they blamed Swarm for the park's poor performance in 2012... Hence the sudden rebrand (a positive, the old branding was ****), and the urge to get the family market in through Angry Birds Land...

This apparently hasn't seemingly worked for them though, so it's back to the drawing board and apparently a bigger IP is what's required; rather than say, tarting up the park, making it presentable AND enjoyable for anyone not buying a Fastrack, investing it filler attractions beyond spinning or roller coasters and really taking a long hard think as to why the park isn't being the juggernaught they want it to be, etc, etc, etc...
Click to expand...

You talk a lot of sense, but surely by turning Thorpe into a family park will take from hand (CWOA) and give to the other (TP).

Surely they're better off going after the thrill market as there's an extremely dense population of youngsters in London.
 
Re: Thorpe Park construction?

Darren B said:
Ready_23 said:
Darren B said:
But we got there in the end, Saw & Stealth were both bad decisions in terms of ride type.
Click to expand...

How can Stealth be both?
Click to expand...

Too many coasters beginning with S. Let's try Saw and SWARM.
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:lol: Makes a bit more sense now :)

Darren B said:
You talk a lot of sense, but surely by turning Thorpe into a family park will take from hand (CWOA) and give to the other (TP).

Surely they're better off going after the thrill market as there's an extremely dense population of youngsters in London.
Click to expand...

This may well be deliberate, Legoland makes them a very high margin and TP does well. Chessie on the other hand doesn't really make Merlin much of a profit. What if for the next 20 years or so TP edges towards the family market, this would eliminate the need for Chessie. Whilst Merlin sold the land and leased it back for other parks they kept the Chessie land probably because of the worth (there are some big houses in that area!) If the current trend continues could we see Merlin sell the Chessie land onto a property developer and make a massive amount on it?

I'm aware that last paragraph is very unlikely to happen ;)
 
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