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marc

Well-Known Member
We are in a situation where our ps3 is on it last legs, needs a bigger disk and new reader.

Probably just going to wait now for the ps4 as there is no point spending money.

I was reading today though that quiet a few people no longer feel tied to Sony as the ps4 cannot play older games so they might switch to the new Xbox.
 

Youngster Joey

Well-Known Member
^Where did they say it can't play older games? They announced you'd be able to get older games...

Also, the Nextbox may not have backwards compatibility either...
 

marc

Well-Known Member
It's said in the conference that some will be on the cloud. It's expected to be very few games.

People stuck with the ps3 at 1st so they could play ps2 games.

So that's what I mean, if you cannot play games you bought and games you downloaded you can stick with the ps3 and get the Xbox as your going to have to start again anyway.

The new Xbox is expected to be true 64bit as well rather than the ps4 being a half bread.
 

Intricks

Well-Known Member
The new systems have always had questionings of Backwards compatibility. The 360 required a download for only a variety of their "greatest hits", followed by just putting them up for DL through their store. The PS3 originally shipped with it, but cut it due to screen resolution issues and basically put the greatest hits up for download for the PS/PS2. Most people still have a working PS2 (me!), so there was no need for it. The Wii, well....yeah, you know.

Now, the PS4 and whatever Microsoft tosses out will no longer be backwards compatible, with Sony going with the PlayStation Cloud and Microsoft doing.....something.

What you read Youngster Joey, is that the PS4 will allow second-hand gaming, something that was rumored to outright disappear with these new consoles. God knows how long those talks have been focused upon, with the fear of that being the cause of death for Console gaming. We see it PC (Steam), and most PC gamers are quite used to it; however, forcing that upon a large group of people at one time whose main use for old games is knocking down the price of something new could be catastrophic financially.

I think cloud gaming could be really useful and effective if done right. You have to install some game info onto the PS3 currently, so that could easily be used to check what games youve owned in the past since they are tied to your account. So they could just push an update that requires you to toss in the game disc so it can be read and verified as a legal copy of said game and it would mark your account as already owning said game.

Or they could go the steam route and just have you 'activate' the game on the clouds internal network. Something or other.
 

ECG

East Coast(er) General
Staff member
Administrator
The most important announcement to me, that was hammered home throughout the conference, is the ease of use for game developers/studios. For years all I've heard is how it's so much easier for development of games on the Xbox compared to the massive difficulties to do likewise on the PS3. It seemed like every developer they presented iterated time & again that ease of use (for them) was the PS4's greatest asset. We as gamers care greatly about the controller, the interface, multiplayer integration, backwards compatibility, social media integration, etc. but what good does all that do if games studios simply don't want to develop for the PS because of unnecessary difficulties? This was the PS3's greatest fault & to hear that Sony has alleviated the issues was the most significant message put forth.
 

furie

SBOPD
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marc said:
People stuck with the ps3 at 1st so they could play ps2 games.

So that's what I mean, if you cannot play games you bought and games you downloaded you can stick with the ps3 and get the Xbox as your going to have to start again anyway.
I agree to a degree, but as I said on Facebook, I think that in reality it's a moot point. When you make the decision to buy the new console, you will naturally tail off playing your old games.

It's rare you have any games that you play religiously enough to put you off replacing the machine. In fact, if a game is so important to you, you'll simply keep you old console just for that game - PS3 trade in will be pennies by this time next year.

It's psychological barrier more than anything. That "they aren't supporting me" thing. When the 360 was released, it wasn't not being able to play on PS2 games which stopped me buying it, it was a lack of game I wanted to play on the system. I did consider it quite a while, but nothing emerged. I'd have still bought a PS3 without PS2 compatibility because it did what I wanted, with a platform I was comfortable with.

The lack of backwards compatibility really isn't such an issue when you actually get down to it, as long as the system offers enough to you to compensate for it.

Marc said:
The new Xbox is expected to be true 64bit as well rather than the ps4 being a half bread.
You do have to be very careful when it comes to tech specs. The PS3 cell CPU is considerably more powerful than the 360 CPU. However, it has less RAM and is shared with the GPU, so it's much more difficult to get graphical clout out of the machine. Add on a difficult instruction set and the PS3 has lagged behind the 360 right through, even though technically the PS3 is the better machine "on paper".

You see a few games like the Uncharted series which push the console to its limits, but they're few and far between.

Likewise, the rumours "NextBox" spec has more cores (at full 64-bit), but lower GPU power and RAM. Apparently the more cores, the tougher it is to get more out of a system when it comes to games. They're great at set code, but not at dynamic code games require. You never know which part of the game is suddenly going to require to be on a different core to take up the slack. Add in the lower spec of the GPU, and the lack of full 64-bit isn't an issue. Both machines will run pretty roughly equally except...

ECG said:
The most important announcement to me, that was hammered home throughout the conference, is the ease of use for game developers/studios. For years all I've heard is how it's so much easier for development of games on the Xbox compared to the massive difficulties to do likewise on the PS3. It seemed like every developer they presented iterated time & again that ease of use (for them) was the PS4's greatest asset. We as gamers care greatly about the controller, the interface, multiplayer integration, backwards compatibility, social media integration, etc. but what good does all that do if games studios simply don't want to develop for the PS because of unnecessary difficulties? This was the PS3's greatest fault & to hear that Sony has alleviated the issues was the most significant message put forth.
Jerry is spot on and this is why Sony have done this. By using the X86 core, they have every coder from the PC and original XBox scene able to jump straight in and produce games.

As I say above, the lack of full 64-bit doesn't hurt much overall, but when it comes to getting the power out into the game, how well coders know it and how much in terms of time resources they need to through at the console is vital.

The complexity of the cell offered no advantage to the PS3, but disadvantaged it as the 360 was seen as a much better console due to the speed coders could get the most from the system, but when porting the PS3, they had constant technical difficulties which they just didn't bother to overcome. So games looked and ran better on the 360.

It's only very recently that the PS3 has become a lead machine for development, but even then, a lot of developers still swear a lot at the tight RAM overheads.

Going back, it's all about what a system offers to you on day one to entice you over. You don't buy a new console to play old games on it, you buy it to play new games. So you need as many high quality games available as possible to you when you migrate.

This doesn't mean the PS4 is a guaranteed success (or that I'll get one), but Sony are doing everything "right" that they Microsoft have done right previously. If MS can get the next XBox out before or simultaneously with the PS4, I can't see the PS4 doing well, but if Sony can grab the holiday sales and maybe 6 months of market before the next XBox, they have a fighting chance - they'll have the good looking games on the market, running well and with a solid line up before Microsoft will even have a launch selection in place. However, MS have a very loyal user base and "getting it right" for ten years gives people a lot of confidence in the brand. It'll be very interesting to see how it all pans out and I'm already putting a bit aside and waiting to see which one deserves my loyalty next...
 

marc

Well-Known Member
I do agree with you Furie but it what a lot of people are talking about and are a bit shocked of the CPU choice. There are a lot of advantages going straight to the x64 chip but it is quite new still. If ms go with this and it gets chosen like now as the dev platform Sony are in the **** as it will be even harder to convert the games. But yes the x64 chip way could also fall flat on its face.

The ps3 was more powerful than the 360 but they could not unlock it. Looks like they have now admitted ms got it right they got it wrong so are following the leader. I am pleased to see they have not simply tried to develop the ps3, they have started again.

As Jerry says now developers can have an easier time on it they should be able to get there.

As for me the draw of the ps3 was being able to play ps2 games. True I don't anymore but can if I want. This for me was the reason like many for not getting the Xbox.

The ps4 will not be in the UK until 2014 the Xbox is expected before then.

The fact we never saw the ps4 and won't for a few more months has also got people saying that they don't actually think its past its final design yet.

Last night bought up a lot of questions that's for sure. We actually don't know much about the console itself.

I do like the fact it's instant switch on and updates are done in a way you can carry on playing.

For me though the share button means nothing other than fb will get even more crap posted on it. I'm not a big online player, think the most group online stuff done was with you are your friends Furie.

It does all seem a great way forward and I will stick with them again. This is also do to the fact I hated the Xbox, it broke all the time and I did not like the controller. I was going to get a 360 the other year but got put off.
 

peep

Well-Known Member
Marc said:
I hated the Xbox, it broke all the time and I did not like the controller.
Same here. Microsoft lost a potential future customer in me as soon as I played with that controller and then created something that was dire in comparison to the PS2. Where was my DVD player? Microsoft made the same mistake with the 360, where's the blu-ray player? Where's the wi-fi? Where's my free online gaming?

All the things that drew me to stay with Sony twice. What games does the Xbox have that the Playstation doesn't? A few first person shooters? There's hundreds of them available on all consoles, why should I care that Xbox has a specific title or two?

Another thing for me was party games. This was something Xbox just didn't provide for (maybe over the last year or so with the kincect but yeah, too late to the party people, the eyetoy was so early 00s :p ). With the Playstation not only did I have several great party game titles but I could still play the ones I had purchased for the previous console. Why would I need to switch console?

However I feel like this could all change with this gen of console. In my opinion so little is known about both consoles but I get the feeling they'll be very similar. I'll probably end up sticking with Sony because I'm a bit of a fanboi and I have more products that the PS4 will just automatically link up with and make awesome stuff happen.

I eagerly await E3 where there's bound to be announcements galore.


Also don't talk to me about Nintendo. They don't make games that appeal to me and our Wii has just sat gathering dust ever since we purchased it. Useless machine.
 

kimahri

Well-Known Member
peep said:
All the things that drew me to stay with Sony twice. What games does the Xbox have that the Playstation doesn't? A few first person shooters? There's hundreds of them available on all consoles, why should I care that Xbox has a specific title or two?
Weirdly, all the worth while exclusives for both consoles are downloadable.

But the line between Microsoft and Sony for exclusives is getting really close atm. I expect that gap to close even more this gen. There could be a possibility of a crash if that gap closes completely. I really do hope there's a surge of New IP's and exclusives this gen though.
 

Smithy

Well-Known Member
I don't understand the issue about backwards compatability, if you've got a load of PS3 games that you still want to play, then logic suggests you'll probably still have your PS3 and be able to play it on there? Takes two seconds to swap a HDMI cable over, some TV's even have two ports for them!
 

marc

Well-Known Member
Yes agree there Smithy, but personally I don't want two consoles.

You could easily say I have a ps3 may as well get the Xbox rather than buy another play station.

It's the same with phones which is why people are sticking with apple or android. Once you spend money on games and apps you don't want to spend that money again.

The new f1 game will come out in September, come feb I won't be able to play it unless I buy it again (if they make a version for ps4) or get the ps3 out again.

Whatever happens sales of games later this year will be effected as people will hold off.
 

ECG

East Coast(er) General
Staff member
Administrator
kimahri said:
I really do hope there's a surge of New IP's and exclusives this gen though.
For certain games or franchises, but not for content. I have both consoles, so no big deal to me either way, but I think that if a game is available for both consoles there shouldn't be any exclusive content for one or the other.
 

kimahri

Well-Known Member
That's not what I was getting at like, exclusive content has been going for years, when your consoles were as different as they were during the SNES and Genesis/Megadrive era (I'll keep the home computers out so I don't confuse your teeny weeny inferior brain) exclusivity between the version were actually selling point to the point where pressing ABACABB in the Genesis version of Mortal Kombat made it the better version. Granted now, It's not needed due to both Sony and MS' machines performing similarly (and have been since PS1, N64 and Saturn era, becoming way more prominent using PS2, ect), but it's not all that bad as long as they don't abuse the exclusivity by making the **** downloadable for a price later on.
 

ECG

East Coast(er) General
Staff member
Administrator
I understand what you are saying, but that doesn't make my comment invalid. And I don't understand where you get off saying that I have a "teeny weeny inferior brain". That simply isn't called for.
 

Pierre

Well-Known Member
Entering PS Plus in March:
• 6th March: Mass Effect 3
• 6th March: Dead or Alive 5
• 6th March: Joe Danger 2
• 13th March: Metal Gear Solid HD Collection (vita)
• 20th March: Puddle (vita)

Looking forward to the Vita selection this month... Not overly fussed on the PS3 selection but at least its diverse from recent ones.
 

furie

SBOPD
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Dead or Alive is actually really good fun. It's nothing deep or anything, but yeah, it's fun.

Mass Effect is pretty massive, looking forward to trying to find time to play it.

Joe Danger is really fab, it's great being included because I almost bought it on release but never got around to it.

Interested in MGS, but only out of vague curiosity. I've never really got on with the games. Puddle is a bit lame.

So it's the PS3 that's exciting for me, though of course, it won't transfer to the PS4 ;)
 
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