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Butterflys Are Not Roller Coasters

To add to the discussion of what is a coaster and what isn't Cedar Point has Pipe Scream listed on the website as a coaster and they added it to the roller coaster wall they have been putting up. I am pretty sure someone asked why these aren't coasters. Cedar Point thinks they are.
 
So is this a coaster?
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^They are.

To be honest, I think the Disk'o coasters probably are. Or they are more than Butterflys at least!
 
ignace said:
TilenB said:
^ Agreed, those don't even complete a full circuit! How about Brandauer's Alpine coasters? There are very few outside the Alps, but they look far less as a coaster than Wiegands. There's single rail for track and cars look less coastery...
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I agree that Bobkarts look less like a coaster, but they feel more coastery.

I count Butterflys. I also count the Ghost Castle in Blackpool (But not the two sides of Grand National because that is ****). My reasoning:

To be a rollercoaster, a ride has to follow all the following rules, but one and only one exception is okay:

-A full circuit
-Wheels on running rails
-Not powered
- The abbility to safely go up using the cars own force (It doesn't have to, but it has to be possible - so in Alpine coasters this is not the case, because people would stall easily right before a hill)
-The car doesn't leave the track
-The train is shorter than 50% off the track length (Bayerncurves with one ring = not a coaster, 2 rings: a coaster)
-It feels like a coaster only the slightiest bit.

Butterflys do count imo. They feel like one, the cars go up, don't leave the track, have wheels and rails. Nautic Jets are shuttle and leave the track = not a coaster. Disko's are powered and shuttle. Powered coasters do count. Menhir Express doesn't (leaves the "track", but doesn't have an actual track either and also doesn't feel like a coaster), but Supersplash in Plopsa does (only breaks one rule).

This is why Butterflys are, to me, in fact coasters. And because I have ridden about ten of these and don't want to lose them on my CC.
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A smidge off topic but this is the best criteria for what constitutes a cred I've ever heard! Only thing I'd change would be adding the creation of a force vector to the list to eliminate drop towers (I kid you not, I hear so many GP around here call Drop Tower a coaster and it hurts a little every time I hear them do it).

I personally don't call anything in the grey area where butterflies lie until I've ridden it. But yes, Disk'Os such as Pipe Scream aren't coasters. Butterflies might be but I haven't ridden one so I won't be making a call on it until I do.
 
Ben said:
^They are.

To be honest, I think the Disk'o coasters probably are. Or they are more than Butterflys at least!
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I've been thinking this more and more lately, especially the ones with a hump.
 
When you actually think of it, there's no argument I can give for why Disk'os aren't coasters but Half Pipes are.

The only argument against the Disk'o is simply that it 'feels' like a flat ride, but so do the Half Pipes?

Everything else is the same. The ones with a hump actually have more of the qualities of a coaster!
 
Noooo, Disk-o's aren't coasters <//3 Tell me honesty, what does it feel like when riding a Disk-o? Does it feel like you're on a flat, or riding a coaster?
 
It feels like a flat ride, but so do Half Pipes?

If Half Pipes weren't counted this would be easy, but they're the wrench in the system for me.

Add the hump in and it's like coasting. No flat rides have that.
 
A disk-o is completely powered, isn't it? Are half-pipes powered? Or has it like a launch section?
 
It has launch section but Disk'Os are only powered to a certain point, then they 'coast' until they run out of momentum and fall back.

Like Half Pipes, just much slower.

But, either way, we count powered coasters?
 
As mentioned before, my rule is that if it feels like a coaster, I count it. I take every case seperately. Powered coasters like the Mack mine train ones definitely feel like a coaster to me. Disk-o's don't at all. I will ride the Half Pipe at Särkänniemi in two weeks, so will make a decision about it then. I think trains also play a major role for me.
 
The main difference between a Disk'O and a half pipe is that on the half pipe it is launched out of the station, while on a Disk'O it is powered by a motor onboard. So why do Disk'Os not count if spinning coasters and powered coasters do, as they are just a combination of both (on an albeit short track).
 
The half pipes are basically the same as an impulse coaster; it's just that the cars are above, rather than below the track.

I don't think (m)any people would argue that an impulse isn't a coaster, so by that reasoning a half pipe has to be.

No on the Diskos though; they don't feel remotely like a coaster, and that includes the ones with the hump. You can't compare them to a spinning coaster. They don't spin; it's a controlled rotation.
 
I don't get this whole "if it's on CC, I'll count it" - It's just someone elses opinion.
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I think because it's a common standard. If everyone else is putting borderline creds on there, then one might feel they have to too in order to get a fair comparison.

That said, I'm a bit stricter and wouldn't counter Butterfiles, super splashes etc.
 
I've been thinking about the whole definition of a cred thing some more recently and I think, for me, it really has to have a hill involved. It's no good just coasting up and down if it doesn't go over a hump.

This would write off butterflies and nautic jets which clearly aren't creds. But it also writes off half-pipes, which I think we all agree are on the far end of what or what isn't a cred.

Interestingly, it would wrote off the smaller discos but include the larger type (such as Cobra at Chessie) that have a hill.

Arguably the Mack supersplashes wouldn't count as they have a dip rather than a hill (like a stretched out halfpipe) but the Plopsa water coaster would count. This sits well with me as I think Plopsa's is more of a cred than the Mack version.

Impulses kinda count has they have a 'vertical hill' but free fall coasters with a straight track would not. I've never really though of those as real coasters anyway.

Just an idea and I'm not going to backdate my count now anyway...
 
Mysterious Sue said:
Arguably the Mack supersplashes wouldn't count as they have a dip rather than a hill (like a stretched out halfpipe) but the Plopsa water coaster would count. This sits well with me as I think Plopsa's is more of a cred than the Mack version.
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But the Plopsa water coaster IS a Mack Supersplash? And is one of the few not to have some form of actual drop prior to the big drop...
 
My mistake, I was thinking for a second it was a Kumbak, but that's Efteling's.
It isn't a normal supersplash though. RCDB used to list it but then pulled it.
 
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