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32 hurt in Big Dipper Crash

As I understand it, if the new system work as its ment to, we wont even see the differnce.

I'm just pleased PBB have not been forced to call time on the brake leavers in favour of the nash-style set up.

Given the events of 2009, and the fact that PBB appear to have been allowed to continue operation the old-school way, I for one hope the Big Dipper, RollerCoaster, Wild Mouse and Zipper Dipper remain manual for some time to come!

Ash
 
I still dont understand how 2 trains ended up on the main track at the same time.

As I stated on page 7, my daughter and I rode the Dipper a number of times the week before the crash, and everytime we rode it the loaded train wasnt allowed to leave the station until the second train had arrived back at the unloading platform.

I have never ever seen the BD operated any other way, and we visit the park 5 - 6 times a year, and ride the BD maybe 4-5 times a visit.

Keeping the existing braking system and not going the NASH way is excellent news, but the operation of the 2 trains should be as above, you dont release the second train until the first is back.

Ive never had to wait more than 10-15 mins to ride the BD even during the summer peaks, so having 2 trains on the track, or one on the lift and one on the track doesnt shift the punters much faster, and takes a risk that isnt needed IMHO.

Just glad its going to be running again.
 
So are they saying this crash was due to a ride op error and totally ignoring the fact a train got stuck on the track? this is how it reads to me.

They are trying to stop a crash happening again by installing cameras, fair enough.

But now tell us why the train got stuck.
 
I still don't see how cameras will help?

As Nacnud (Duncan I assume :) ) says - one train on the circuit at all times = no accidents and no loss of throughput.

If a ride op is determined to send a train quickly to get off home early - they'll do it anyway. Once that train is off the lift hill, there's no stopping it. So if the camera says the train is on the home straight and the ride-op lets the train off the hill - then the returning train gets stuck before the station? Well, you have another crash.

Cameras solve nothing if there isn't a mechanism in place to stop the ride ops from releasing trains too quickly.
 
^I agree with you, I have been saying the same from day 1.

Health and Saftey must have passed this, but there is nothing to stop human error.

I still think when it opens we will see it operate with only one train on the track at one time.
 
I was up in Blackpool today and they had workmen on it all day. Looked like they were checking the track or something similar. It did look weird with it closed. They have placed up the metal crowd barriers across the steps down to it.
 
No you wasn't So shut up !!!!. I bet you just some 12 year old brain dead retarded pot smoking chav wanabe. Whe has not even been to blackpool.


Is there any real fail safe way to keep it as safe as possible and keep the coaster as it is ?
 
kitsune said:
No you wasn't So shut up !!!!. I bet you just some 12 year old brain dead retarded pot smoking chav wanabe. Whe has not even been to blackpool.
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I agree with everything you just said, except for the marijuana. He's not cool enough for that. Neither am I for that matter. :wink:

It's weird how he claims to have ridden coasters all over America, as well as basically everything in the UK...
 
Big Dipper is nearly re-tracked now. :)

The trains will look different once the ride has re-opened, as well as the station.

And by the looks of it, new CCTV is setup on the ride to stop any repeats to what happened a few weeks back.
 
^^ that makes me happy. Pics of the station were on the BPB forum, and it looks nice.

So it is apparant that CCTV is how they'll manage two cars. Still too much of a risk of op error, in my opinion. Supposedly they going to run just one car when they re-open anyway.
 
ICoastCoasters said:
^^ that makes me happy. Pics of the station were on the BPB forum, and it looks nice.

So it is apparant that CCTV is how they'll manage two cars. Still too much of a risk of op error, in my opinion. Supposedly they going to run just one car when they re-open anyway.
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Not quite the forum you've mentioned, it was on the forum I am running, PBR Experience, that we got first updates of re-tracking work and the work being done in the station. I wont post a link because I've already done that in advertisements on here.

The CCTV will be to keep an eye on the where abouts of the trains to stop any repeats of the incident in August.
 
Bit fed up with saying this CCTV will not stop a repeat happening.

Speed camera's do not stop people from speeding and CCTV does not stop people from shop lifting.

Also what caused the crash? you can not blame ride ops for a train getting stuck.
 
Bicko said:
And by the looks of it, new CCTV is setup on the ride to stop any repeats to what happened a few weeks back.
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Nobody has explained yet to me or Marc how this is going to stop it happening again?

Train is off-loading, send out train in station. Load train in station waiting for other train to reach off-load point. Repeat all day = NO ACCIDENTS.

Train on lift hill while train is on track. Check CCTV, train is still moving, keep lift hill going. Check CCTV, train on return straight, let second train off lift hill. Check CCTV, train stuck on return straight before off-load = ACCIDENT!

CCTV can not stop the accidents. Only a simple system that doesn't slow dispatch down at all will stop it. It's very simple.

Is train off-loading passengers? Yes - Release full train to lift hill. No - Wait until train is off-loading passengers.

Does it really get any simpler than that?

[edit]Marc posted as I was :lol:
 
Did the ride operators know the other train had got stuck? No.

If they had camera's installed on the ride to see where the train was stuck and why it hadnt returned, would they have continued to send another train, knowing it would cause an accident? No they had no idea, they sent the train clearly thinking a collison wasnt going to happen.

I am not saying an accident is never going to happen again, but if the operators know the where abouts of the trains at all times, then they are going to know if a train has got stuck this time and not dispatch the second train, or stop the second train on the lift hill.
 
With the CCTV thing, we could use the old crime prevention argument.

A CCTV camera in a city centre will not stop a crime happening. It may help assist the people monitoring the CCTV to make decisions.

That's exactly what the CCTV on TBD is for. It's an extra pair of eyes that could help prevent an accident but is by no means a fool-proof way of stopping it.

Any ideas when TBD will open again?
 
And if it was operated one train on the track at one time none of it would have happened, and it would never happen again.

Honest for the sake of 2 mins none of this needed to happen.

Yes I agree Ian, and thats why the word "stop" needs to be not used, the word avoid should be used :)
 
marc said:
And if it was operated one train on the track at one time none of it would have happened, and it would never happen again.

Honest for the sake of 2 mins none of this needed to happen.
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Why change something which has been operated in the same way for alot of years?

Big Dipper used to run three trains without issue.

Ok its had an accident on two trains, but how many accidents did it have before that, running in exactly the same way?

Ian, Big Dipper is having work done to finish the re-tracking and then should be testing soon. It is expected to re-open this year but nobody knows for certain as yet. As we all know, PBB like to keep us all guessing.
 
Like I said before there still should be an automatic system which in the case of human error letting a train go the system can stop the train on the lift hill. You would have thought this would have been recommended especially after the recent accident.
 
Emmett said:
Like I said before there still should be an automatic system which in the case of human error letting a train go the system can stop the train on the lift hill. You would have thought this would have been recommended especially after the recent accident.
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I have read that a new system is being put in place. I am not sure how true that is, but it came from a Pleasure Beach engineer whos doing work on the Dipper, so I can only assume hes right.

Posted on 23rd August, so a while back, on PBR Experience;

The manual brakes are staying, but a block system will be installed which will stop the lift chain if a train doesn't flag a sensor within a certain time, also the station is having a new colour scheme.
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