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Rumor: Hollywood Studios gets Green Light for Cars Land

Mike said:
Ok, thanks for cleaning up what conversations are actually going on. I can now give my tuppence worth...



Are you talking about the resort as a whole, or just DHS here? Either way, I don't really understand the point your making.

The place works great as a cash cow (well, it's hardly a dog or a question mark, and it can't really obtain too much market growth to become a star as it already gets so many visitors), and the fact that the resort takes up 4 of the top 8 places in theme park attendance figures in 2011 (with the other 4 places being other Disney parks), with only Epcot failing to get an increase in visitor numbers tells me that you saying the parks are "clearly beginning to fail" is clearly a load of rubbish, and the "politics" can't be changing the quality of the resort by that much.

It did not used to be regarded as just a cash cow but the jewel of their collection. Now paint is peeling, burnt out bulbs plague the property, main attractions are functioning on near safe mode level, and others are cursed with constant downtime. Oh yes! The Disco Yeti; let's not remove that. The Resort as a whole are beginning to fail. The financial reports clearly show that. The increase in discounts represents it in a much more in your face fashion. 1% P&R growth with DCA booming and cash raking ships on the seven seas? Screams at WDW bleeding $$$$$$$s. We all know if the demand was there as people seem to think that they would not be offering all these discounts make people feel like they are getting a deal and get them there.

The politics clearly are a direct reflection. Look at the background of those in charge. Look at the lack of innovation that the property and company used to be known for. Listen to Iger speak. It is beyond obvious.

Mike said:
The reason for Cars Land (or any new area) being on the cards for DHS is because the whole Backlands area is stagnating badly. How many people do you think would tell you they visit the park for the Backlot Tour? I'm going to guess nobody...
The Tour has been shortening and getting rid of things since the park opened, and the whole area takes up a HUGE space, so it's only almost natual that the parks planning team will look at this area to develop in in the future.

A half day park is not acceptable when paying a premium for the product offered. If it was intended to be a half day park then explain the reasoning behind a one day ticket costing the same for DHS as MK.

Mike said:
A bit of a non-point, in my opinion.
When the park was first opened, it was only designed to be a half-day park themed around a working movie studio, which was never going to be viable in the long-term. Disney (or any theme park), are not going to pull the punters in if they don't lk to continually expand and upgrade, and people don't want to travel to Florida for a "working movie studio". Plans are continually changed and evolved anyway, so, as I said, a non-point.

Part of its original lineup was to view a working studio which made it more than a half day park. Nothing was truly put in place to gain that back once the studio ordeal was shut up. Keep in mind I did not bring the not fitting with studios theme up yet simply that it has evolved past it with no direction. Studios was also hacked in plans when it was built.

Mike said:
Weren't we just/still in a major global economic recession? Chopping budgets sounds like a sensible thing to do to me.

That is a rather sorry excuse. For a company that posted profits during the recession it makes it that much more sorry. Chopping budgets to get more and more attractions based around screens is not acceptable. Hence why IoA is picking up slack left off. DVC Members are venturing of WDW property on their regular visits. Maybe that is why they upped the Annual Pass discount so much for WDW Members. They are tired of stale Lay's chips.

Mike said:
From this, it sounds like they planned to put Cars Land in DHS anyway, but when they realised it wasn't possible for now they have just transferred it over to California. I don't understand why this is something to get angry over.

DCA was in a very similar boat as DHS. It needed something huge to draw crowds. John Lasseter whose first job was at DLR oversaw the creative process through ribbon cut. It was designed for DCA first and foremost but appears to have kept DHS in mind. Gonna try to deny the mess DCA was in?

Mike said:
I've never even heard of this project, but a new coaster sounds good to me.

It began early onsite work in 2008 but was canned fast.

Mike said:
Err, what?
Mystic Point and Grizzly Gulch at Hong Kong? New Fantasyland, Avatar Land, Cars Land and Test Track for Florida? The ever-going rumours of a third park in Paris? New cruise ships, holiday packages..etc...etc...
These all sound like "major items" to me...

And how many of those are open? Which rehab you listed is going to be a bit underwhelming? Cruise ships are paid for; off the books. FLE was spread of five years to lessen the bottom line's impact. CarsLand is over. Test Track is a gut with modest digital projections and skimp dark scenery. Not much cost there. Paris is not getting a third park anytime soon. That is off the books. Pandora has stalled worse than a 16yo who thinks they are in The Fast and the Furious for the time being. With that little on the current plate there are more than enough resources to carry out CL and NakedBluePeople at the same time.


Mike said:
So, yeah, those are my opinions. I could be (and probably am) wrong on a few points, but how these subjects have brought up 5 pages of bombazzlement is beyond me.

Opinions are what fuels discussions! Cheers!
 
UC said:
I'm more or less in agreement with Mike on this one. I don't quite think what you're saying is accurate. While I don't doubt your claims that you're "connected," somehow, I do think more of what you're saying is speculation based on what a friend said than actual information.

Given the track record over the course of 10+ years of the people I have gotten it from I feel it is very accurate.

UC said:

People. People. People. Meet one, leads to another, and another. Hearing things that baffle you; want to know more.


UC said:
This isn't specific enough. Tons of projects get stalled. In fact, the only reason this one was even announced was knee-jerk reaction to competitors in the area. It's a bit like owning a new house - if you get your COO (certificate of occupancy) two weeks too soon, you're going to feel like nothing's finished.

The fact the project has been pushed forward is proof enough that they're taking it seriously, so this statement makes little sense. It's just words thrown around because something was announced for a couple of years from now, and people are angry that they haven't seen any work.

Exactly! A knee jerk reaction! Exactly why the project has hit so many issues. The question for you is how far forward has it actually gone? Not very far at all. Penny pinchers that chop hours out for the sake of bottom line, switch main EMH offerings for CTicket to save on cost are the ones holding the project up. It is TDO. TDAnaheim is busting along with a billion dollar expansion in one park, a MARVELous one planned with early work starting in their other park, and quality hard ticket events. Very different style of managements. One is booming while one is struggling.

UC said:
Wow, alright. You've made a lot of very specific claims there, and the bottom line is if you were as well connected as you claim to be, you wouldn't be saying this stuff on a public coaster forum.

The first rule of working in/knowing reliable individuals in the industry is you keep your mouth shut regarding specific details.

Checking with people, waiting for them to post, and then being able to repeat what told is the proper order. The one that I follow.

With that said, let's start picking some of this apart.

UC said:
This should surprise no one, and I'm not sure why you're focusing on this - Disney (and most major parks) does things like this all of the time. It's a cheap way to bring popular attractions to multiple parks. It's nothing other than a dressed up version of buying a Vekoma SLC.

Glad you concur on its high odds of coming! It does Walmart the brand however. Steals business from one and saturates the offerings. Many would be less likely to head to the land of fun and the sun of they can go to their beloved OTown to see it.

UC said:
Adding on to this the fact that many Disney parks are hub-based and own a lot of land (especially the ones in Florida), and you're pulling at stones to claim it was designed for DHS. You could fit it almost anywhere. To make that claim is like saying "This sticky tack was designed to hold this paper to this wall."

The item you seem to be forgetting is the prep work that goes into the unused land. Soft ground is a very large issue but planning it to overlay on a dying area of used land lessens the cost that much more.

UC said:
Yeah, alright. Just as it was in 2007...and 2008...and 2009...

First talk of it surfaced around 2007 but 2008 saw the first actual work (although minor) done in park for it. Anything past '08 is fanboi speculation reviving an old project. It was mentioned recently as a part of the expansion.

UC said:
The bottom line is this attraction is probably completely hashed out at this point, and just waiting for the opportune time to get the go-ahead, when there aren't more pressing matters (which there always are). The MI ride was conceived at a time when everything was smooth sailing for WDW, and they had the cash to blow on smaller rides just to keep the ball rolling. This isn't the case anymore. There are far more pressing matters, including the rapid and successful emergence of some strong competitors, that are forcing the small projects to the backburner until the bigger things come out.

I would call this more pressing matters. Q4 reports will be about in a couple weeks and will be very interesting to read. I would not say in the slightest form 00's were smooth sailing for WDW. Eisner's last run was the start of a downfall for penny pinches. Yes! So you see the issue; little neighbor down the road is booming with innovation while TheLandofPixieDust is sitting around with its head to the side looking confused.

UC said:
I'd be surprised if the ride you're referring to ever comes to light. The next movie is set to release in 2013, and I guarantee that will be the true go-or-no-go test. If the movie does well, you may see it pushed up. If not, well, you're probably never going to see it at all.

The days of Disney wantonly spending cash on things out of their anticipation of franchise success are over, and you need to understand that. If the new Monsters Inc. movie shows signs of people continuing interest in the franchise, you may see something come up.

Right now, though, there are bigger fish to fry - and Monsters, Inc. Laugh Floor doesn't pull in the kinds of numbers one would think justifies an additional franchise attraction.

Bigger fish being the fact that WDW has laid dormant. DHS is lacking in offerings. Take RnR outta the equation and what are you left with that is not aging? Not really anything. Fantasmic is breaking at a rapid rate with a few shows a month being cancelled. That did not used to happen.

UC said:
This statement right here makes me question any connection to the "inner workings" you claim to have.

You completely underestimate the time and resources dedicated to this market. It is very much a case of "all hands on deck" - and you can rest assured that they take priority at the moment.

I'm not suggesting that Disney is incapable of doing multiple things at once, merely that projects the scale you're talking of are not something they throw around any more. Those days left when they realized they weren't the only fish in the sea.

The current focus on WDW is Fantasyland 2.0. Once that is over, they'll move on to their next announced project.

Take a look at what was going on at the time Disney Sea was being built. Two other parks. They could pull that off with the best park in the company then WDI surely has the resources.


UC said:
Part of being successful in this industry is not over-saturating your guests. If you build too much too soon, you give people no reason to come back, and you give them plenty of reason to hold off their current vacations until you're finished with everything. Hence why multiple major projects for the same areas are almost never announced, and started, concurrently, and the days of the age where you could just "start work" on something and have no one notice until they've spent their money to show up and see it for themselves are over. We have the internet, and it takes us all of sixty seconds to figure out what's going on halfway around the world.

Over saturating, eh? Like people coming back to the parks and nothing new is offered? Sounds exactly like what is going on. You are correct, things do not just happen at the click of fingers and sprinkles of the MAGICal dust emitted by the fireworks. You as well are not looking at TDA and what they have turned around in Cali after the former management was ousted when DLR started hemorrhagic $$$s. The pull it off. TDO is clinching onto the seat and running. (That can be found elsewhere as well).

UC said:
Parks, especially resorts like Disney who rely on their guests coming and staying for a period of time, spread out their new additions. It's the best way to get bang for your buck. You let people focus and drive on one thing at a time, and add your stop-gap fillers in between. THIS would be the niche that, assuming all goes well with the new movie, the supposed MI coaster would fill.

So no, it's not down to "multiple projects at the same time." That would be fiscal suicide, and believe me, Disney knows it. They'll be finishing up Fantasyland 2.0 soon. After that, it will be on to the next announced project.

Notice I did not say MIDC is near as concrete as CL but is on the table as a serious addition. You call it fiscal suicide but forget about the ships built, DCA's expansion, Shangai, and FLE that were all going on at the same time. The issue with CL is that NakedBluePeople has been announced. But thus the plan for CL is much farther down the line of happening than Pandora.


UC said:
DAK is running its course until Avatar arrives. Avatar is to be the latest "fix" for DAK. That said, the park isn't exactly struggling, and why anyone still thinks it is is beyond me. It's actually been the only WDW park that has had a steady - albeit minor - increase in total patronage over the last four years. It's equipped perfectly well enough to survive until 2014 or so.

DAK had its hours chopped from a popular time during EMH to nothing post 6pm. That wreaks of budget cutting. Notice the trend of its increase. Patrons move to those not regularly visited.

UC said:
DHS isn't struggling either. The new fastpass system will require patrons to reserve later times at the park for the rides and - more importantly - Fantasmic, which will keep people in the area longer. Adding Fantasmic to the system was a stroke of genius, to be honest. Additionally, it sees a higher percentage of AP holders, due to the nature of its rides, which always help keep numbers higher.

DHS is not struggling when a project is moving faster than another announced project? Screams of needing something fast. Fantasmic with the nearly inoperable Maleficent and regularly breaking lift for finale Mickey. Fantasmic is another victim of lax maintenance. AP discounts have gone up for CMs and DVC Members. If there was a good number of those then they would not have upped the discount. Simple supply and demand.

UC said:
It always blows me away when people accuse any of the WDW parks of being "weak." Would Disney like to keep people around? Of course - but they aren't going to do it with major expansions. They're much smarter than to blow money like that. They're doing it by offering more night entertainment at the venues specifically related to that - Downtown Disney, for example (which also helps cater to DHS's typically youthful audience).

You sound like TDO with thinking WDW is invincible. Fresh offerings are required to get people there and keep them coming back. Laying off projects and keeping the same will/does not work. What reason is there to keep people returning? Nothing. This data/money mining initiative of NextGen surely is not really going to help. Seems that is the reason a DHS expansion is being ramrodded like a form of heal... don't think I should go there.

I do not know if you are serious about DtD. Have you really been there recently? Pleasure Island is sitting mostly dormant, DisneyQuest is rotting with broken games and entrance elevator that's special features are hardly every working. Splitsville, which conveniently is being funded by Splitsville, is the best thing going for the area. Otherwise it is a Disney exclusive shopping mall with nice dining venues. Nothing to write home about, nothing truly unique other than the WDW mall.


UC said:
All of this talk of needing major expansions, and of things being fast-tracked for these perceived problems, it's all just knee-jerk talk, and to be honest, it sounds like its coming from someone who believes that WDW is their only property in the world. Disney isn't going to fire off a bunch of projects in panic mode, they're being much more calculated than that.

I and several others feel it is much more than knee jerk. Guess the next few months will tell, eh? Feels like it is the only property they have... or someone who goes rather frequently and like others have found offerings are better down I4 or just across it.
 
Youngster Joey said:
This has gone way more off topic than I thought it would. The point being like I said, I don't want it and even if it does come it won't be until after 2016. So who knows what will happen between now and then.

:wink: Sooner than you think will something head this way.. er OTown's way.
 
Now paint is peeling, burnt out bulbs plague the property, main attractions are functioning on near safe mode level, and others are cursed with constant downtime.

You are visiting the same parks as me, right?
"Main attractions are running on near safe mode level"... What does this even mean? Of course they're going to run rides on a safe level! What kind of a statement is that?!
If you get into your hotel room and you find a burnt out bulb, I'm sure a quick ring down to concierge will get the problem fixed quickly! Hardly a "plaguing problem".
And which rides are "cursed" with constant downtime? I can't think of any attractions that have permanent problems...


The Disco Yeti; let's not remove that.
Good idea! To remove the Yeti from Expedition Everest would cost hundreds of thousands through having to take down half the mountain. 95% of guests wouldn't even know that the Yeti is supposed to move anyway, so what would be the point in taking it out?

A half day park is not acceptable when paying a premium for the product offered. If it was intended to be a half day park then explain the reasoning behind a one day ticket costing the same for DHS as MK.

The tickets are priced the same because there is clearly more than enough people still willing to pay full price to make the pricing scheme a viable option. By your reckoning, half-day parks should be half the price. I'm not an economist, but I'm not sure theme park pricing or supply and demand curves really work like that. And how many people buy a full priced one-day one-park ticket anyway? I'm going to guess not many!

Part of its original lineup was to view a working studio which made it more than a half day park.

No, it didn't.
When the park opened, it was pretty much ONLY the Backlot Tour (which started in the current Animation Courtyard) to do, which consisted of a small walking section followed by the standard train ride. You think that this was a 10 hour attraction? Right.

Chopping budgets to get more and more attractions based around screens is not acceptable.
What? You do realise that 90% of Disney attractions are based around their movies and TV shows, right?

As for the rest, I feel UC elaborates pretty well on this point.

DVC Members are venturing of WDW property on their regular visits.

Yes, because shock and horror, Disney now has some actual competition! Potter World has worked wonders for Universal, and Disney has been almost forced to respond by changing pricing strategies...etc.

DCA was in a very similar boat as DHS.
Possibly, but you do know the two parks are NOTHING like eachother, right? Just because a rejuvanation plan worked for one park doesn't mean you can just do the same stuff for a totally different park on the opposite side of the country. I'm sure DHS could pull in a ton of new people by opening up a huge pier with an incredible coaster on it, but it ain't happening anytime soon!

And how many of those are open? Which rehab you listed is going to be a bit underwhelming? Cruise ships are paid for; off the books. FLE was spread of five years to lessen the bottom line's impact. CarsLand is over. Test Track is a gut with modest digital projections and skimp dark scenery. Not much cost there. Paris is not getting a third park anytime soon. That is off the books. Pandora has stalled worse than a 16yo who thinks they are in The Fast and the Furious for the time being. With that little on the current plate there are more than enough resources to carry out CL and NakedBluePeople at the same time.

Did you actually read or understand anything UC said? Your paragraph sounds like someone who has no idea how much things cost and no idea how the theme park industry works. I mean, I'd describe Curse of DarKastle as "modest digital projections and skimp dark scenery", and have a look at how much that cost!

And how many of those are open? Which rehab you listed is going to be a bit underwhelming? Cruise ships are paid for

So, you ask a question about how many other projects Disney are currently working on other than Shanghai, and then get annoyed when I give you a very valid list of things going on all over the world that all require immense time, costs and preperations? Kay.

It's a dangerous game getting into these kinds of "discussions" on CF, and you're playing a fools game to start one with UC over things you sound like you're speculating over.
 
Look's like Cars Land is an actual go...

http://www.wdwinfo.com/news/Theme_Parks_Attractions/Cars_Land_is_coming_to_DHS.htm


...****

I can not clearly articulate how utterly stupid I think Disney's Park Management team is. I've said it before and I'll say it again. It was the one thing to make California's adventure different and worth visiting more than once.

I understand it is INSANELY profitable for Disney but the movies were **** and there was so many other options to put in MGM studios.
 
This topic alienates me so badly with all the quote mongering from before. I don't trust it yet, I'll wait and see when the stunt show gets shut down, and start from there. Right now there's nothing even hinting at this other than pure speculation and people saying they have an inside scoop, and they disagree with each other on different boards.
 
^Indeed. I truly hope it's all speculation but I wouldn't put it past Disney. In fact, I would be more surprised if they DIDN'T put it at MGM. It's a quick and easy money grab.
 
From what I read yesterday they are removing the stunt show and the backlot tour and its going there.

No one knows its it's a clone or what rides will be in the area yet.
 
I'd believe a clone. It's Disney remember.

Still think is really really stupid decision by management. It's nothing more than a giant money grab on a horrible IP.

As for Backlot tour I thought it was nothing special to begin with and it has been there for years and years. I won't be sad to see it go but it Hollywood studios is losing what made it a studio
 
A horrible ip that makes them loads of money. I don't have a problem with the characters in cars I just have a problem with the stories.

I have actually changed my mind on this and now think it will look great where they are building it.

The park needs something to get people there and this will help.

So many people do not go to California so will not even know about the other one.
 
Remember though Cars is horrible in our minds, not in the minds of all the 7-12 year old kids which Disney markets to heavily. The kids don't care about how bad the movie was, as long as they can immerse themselves in the world of Cars it's basically already a win for Disney.

I think that's where the rumors on Disney's budget cuts are coming from, because it doesn't matter to the kids just how realistic it is as long as they still make money off of it.
 
Getting a bit fed up with hearing of these so called budget cuts when there is no proof.

Everyone that's been to cars land has said it's amazing even people who don't like the films.
 
Youngster Joey said:
^I've heard of budget cuts to Avatarland for this project. Nothing more than rumors of course.

I also heard that Magic Kingdom Expansion had budget cuts xD. Any other insane rumors that don't really matter at the moment that want to come out of the shed? :arrow:
 
Monsters Inc Door coaster, Marvel park/land, star wars park/land. And batting cleanup the infinitely ongoing rumor of a 5th gate

Just off the top of my head
 
How many times does it have to be said. Every project had budget cuts, even in work we do.

We price up a project and say it will be £10,000 and they say do it for £8,000. We then go round different firms and get the parts cheaper, the project at the end is the same as what it was at the start just done cheaper.

People will always ask for more than they need.
 
Youngster Joey said:
^I've heard of budget cuts to Avatarland for this project. Nothing more than rumors of course.
Actually, there's no budget cut rumoured for that, the biggest rumour is the whole thing has been cut. The rumour goes that due to creative disputes between James Cameron & Disney Imagineer's, it's been left in the air what's going to happen with it and it's off the cards until further notice, nothing about budget cut.
 
Clone or not, the Tram Tour and Stunt show are both "once per visit" attractions for me, so Cars Land will bring something more attractive/vibrant to the Studios IMO. It looks like it'll be one of them nice area's where you can just walk about and soak up the atmosphere, if you really don't want to ride.
 
^Could not agree with you more, that's what I was trying to say.

Lofty read that to about Avatar land, it really looks like its not going to happen and that's why the Hollywood Studio development is. I heard though it was due to how much Cameron wants for the sale of merchandise.

If Avatar land happens it will be after this.

Who really knows though.
 
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