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Kings Island | Orion | B&M Giga Coaster

I don't quite understand the hate, but I also don't think it's real hate just enthusiasts doing what we do. I mean...KI is getting a giga. This is like a decade of memes finally being put to rest lol
It's still a giga. Will still be great. It all comes down to those hills for me. Weak air and we have a big Diamondback which is pretty lame. Strong sustained air/great pull and we have a big SFoG Goliath, which is pretty epic.
 
JJLehto said:
I don't quite understand the hate, but I also don't think it's real hate just enthusiasts doing what we do. I mean...KI is getting a giga. This is like a decade of memes finally being put to rest lol
It's still a giga. Will still be great. It all comes down to those hills for me. Weak air and we have a big Diamondback which is pretty lame. Strong sustained air/great pull and we have a big SFoG Goliath, which is pretty epic.
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I agree 100%. I get that its not the BEST giga, but it's still a giga - aren't they awesome coasters anyway?

Us folks back in the UK would kill for something like this! heck, even a B&M hyper would be great
 
And in further reflection on Orion as I've been recently reading some dorky physics books:
3ncm4o.jpg
 
I’m heading to Kings Island later this year and can’t wait to go on this.

I am probably a bit more of a ‘GP/enthusiast’ rather than a pure ‘enthusiast’, but I think if you focus too much on details and minutiae then you can end up spoiling things for yourself. It’s often far more fun and enjoyable to let go of hype and just go with it.

For example *zips up flame proof suit* the newer Star Wars films - if you are constantly comparing them to The Empire Strikes Back then you will never, ever be satisfied. “Oh but x. Y and z wasn’t great” or whatever.... suspend your disbelief, grab your popcorn and have fun.

Aren’t we all in it to have fun?

This isn’t Fury 325. But it’ll still be great. I choose to view it that way. And surprise... I’ll have a really good time. I hope!!

You can apply that to life in general. But hey, what do I know? :)
 
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oriolat2 said:
This last picture makes Orion look extremely short. I know the elements are big and take lots of feet of track but there are so few elements it's just sad.
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I recently saw a photo of Orion from the top of Diamondback and thought Orion looked really short. My initial thought was that Diamondback is sitting on higher ground, which is actually true...but then I started thinking about the overall ride heights. One would think of a near 100 foot height difference between a hyper coaster and a giga coaster, but Orion is 287 feet tall and Diamondback is 230 feet tall. There is a 57 foot height difference between the rides which is further minimized by the changes in ground level under each ride. This is yet another perspective which views this ride as laughable.

Seriously, I cannot get past how Orion seems like such a lazy design. All they needed to do was stretch the brake run 13ish feet (assuming the lift is a 45° slope, which it's probably slightly less) and they would have shut everybody up.
 
I think Orion could suprise us with a great first drop as itt does have the steepest drop on a b&m gigga and is the same gradient as I305 but we will see. Visiting the USA next year and should hit all the giggas (and yes I am counting Orion as a gigga, it's all about drop hight for me)
 
Nitefly said:
I’m heading to Kings Island later this year and can’t wait to go on this.

I am probably a bit more of a ‘GP/enthusiast’ rather than a pure ‘enthusiast’, but I think if you focus too much on details and minutiae then you can end up spoiling things for yourself. It’s often far more fun and enjoyable to let go of hype and just go with it.

For example *zips up flame proof suit* the newer Star Wars films - if you are constantly comparing them to The Empire Strikes Back then you will never, ever be satisfied. “Oh but x. Y and z wasn’t great” or whatever.... suspend your disbelief, grab your popcorn and have fun.

Aren’t we all in it to have fun?

This isn’t Fury 325. But it’ll still be great. I choose to view it that way. And surprise... I’ll have a really good time. I hope!!

You can apply that to life in general. But hey, what do I know? :)
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Truthpost of the year on all levels.

Oh, and I also don't know if anyone pointed this out yet; Kings Island claims a 3 minute ride on Orion; which mean ~1:15 spent on the brake run. :p
 
Antinos said:
I recently saw a photo of Orion from the top of Diamondback and thought Orion looked really short. My initial thought was that Diamondback is sitting on higher ground, which is actually true...but then I started thinking about the overall ride heights. One would think of a near 100 foot height difference between a hyper coaster and a giga coaster, but Orion is 287 feet tall and Diamondback is 230 feet tall. There is a 57 foot height difference between the rides which is further minimized by the changes in ground level under each ride. This is yet another perspective which views this ride as laughable.

Seriously, I cannot get past how Orion seems like such a lazy design. All they needed to do was stretch the brake run 13ish feet (assuming the lift is a 45° slope, which it's probably slightly less) and they would have shut everybody up.
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Counterpoint: The 300 foot first drop on Orion is 85 feet higher than the 215 foot first drop on Diamondback meaning Orion has 140% the first drop of Diamondback. If you're looking for similarities, the 202 foot turnaround on Orion is only 28 feet shorter than Diamondback, and tall enough to be a Hyper without the first drop.

While I'm riding it, the knowledge that the terrain is contributing 13 feet to the height of the drop isn't going to affect my ride experience. At the end of the day, ride experience is what matters. Like Nitefly said, it's all about having fun, and Orion looks like a seriously fun ride.
 
Jcoasters said:
It's pretty obvious they did it not to nerf MF
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Wow, this is a ridiculous claim. They have the same drop height--in fact, Orion's drop is even steeper than MF. Orion looks to be a better ride--a great variety of elements vs. MF's forcless overbanks and straight track. But everyone is going to say MF is better because how dare Orion be a B&M!!!!!
Also, I love how everyone conveniently forgets that the top of the lift hill will be the highest point guests can be at at Kings Island. The previous highest point was the top observation platform on the Eiffel Tower (275 feet).
Why is everyone blaming Kings Island and Cedar Fair for designing a ride with a broad audience in mind? The last time they built a ride for enthusiasts (Steel Vengeance), Cedar Point had a lower attendance than Kings Island for 2018--and all Kings Island built was a new barbecue restaurant! But again...everyone blames B&M because HOW DARE THEY DESIGN A RIDE FOR EVERYONE, NOT JUST A SMALL PERCENTAGE OF ATTENDANCE!
Rob Decker retired from Cedar Fair in 2019, but the last coaster layout he worked on was Orion. He worked on the layouts of Leviathan and Fury. Jamie Gaffney, Kings Island's VP of maintenance and construction who assisted with the layout from the park's end, was in the same position at Carowinds during the design of Fury 325. Kings Island and Cedar Fair know what they are doing. They know how to make a great ride. They know how to make a giga coaster. They know what's best for Kings Island. Coaster enthusiasts don't.
Orion will blow everyone (on here at least) away. It will be smooth, dynamic, unique, and reridable. But no one on here will admit it--because who likes admitting they were wrong?
 
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KIFan said:
Wow, this is a ridiculous claim. They have the same drop height--in fact, Orion's drop is even steeper than MF. Orion looks to be a better ride--a great variety of elements vs. MF's forcless overbanks and straight track. But everyone is going to say MF is better because how dare Orion be a B&M!!!!!
Also, I love how everyone conveniently forgets that this the top of the lift hill will be the highest point guests can be at at Kings Island. The previous highest point was the top observation platform on the Eiffel Tower (275 feet).
Why is everyone blaming Kings Island and Cedar Fair for designing a ride with a broad audience in mind? The last time they built a ride for enthusiasts (Steel Vengeance), Cedar Point had a lower attendance than Kings Island for 2018--and all Kings Island built was a new barbecue restaurant! But again...everyone blames B&M because HOW DARE THEY DESIGN A RIDE FOR EVERYONE, NOT JUST A SMALL PERCENTAGE OF ATTENDANCE!
Rob Decker retired from Cedar Fair in 2019, but the last coaster layout he worked on was Orion. He worked on the layouts of Leviathan and Fury. Jamie Gaffney, Kings Island's VP of maintenance and construction who assisted with the layout from the park, was in the same position at Carowinds during the design of Fury 325. Kings Island and Cedar Fair know what they are doing. They know how to make a great ride. They know how to make a giga coaster. They know what's best for Kings Island. Coaster enthusiasts don't.
Orion will blow everyone (on here at least) away. It will be smooth, dynamic, unique, and reridable. But no one on here will admit it--because who likes admitting they were wrong?
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Hear hear people seem unable to get past their disappointment that this isn't taller or longer. It's still a Gigga coaster, has a fantasticaly steep first drop and short but decent layout.

I felt similar with iron gwazi when I first saw it- a much shorter layout than I expected and much less airtime moments than Vengeance with it looking pretty similar to Zadra in terms of a speed an intensity layout. Was expecting BGT to try and one up Vengeance for world's best coaster and it just doesn't look like it will do that.

In the UK we don't even have a B&M Hyper and people would be incredibly happy if we got even a 200ft hyper
 
Thank you Mr. KIFan. I will definitely consider your position of Orion as a valid opinion. You ARE a Kings Island fan, therefore you must know more than us uncivilized, non-Kings Island fans.

To address your overwhelming KI fanboy energy: God I'm glad I don't have this insufferable mentality. I (and many others) have no doubt Orion will be fun. I am not expecting it to be anything more than "fun" though. Solid 7 or 8/10 material here. Any criticism of the ride is absolutely deserved. The same parent company that purchased Fury 325, also purchased this layout. THAT is why this ride is getting flamed to oblivion, and deservedly so IMO. I have 3 main complaints:
  • The fact that there IS a debate whether it's a Giga in and of itself is the first point. Seriously couldn't've gone another 13 vertical feet?
  • That turnaround. You have at least 85mph of speed entering it, go up 200ft... and do THAT. A totally uninspired bank & dive. Not one ounce of "flare" or anything neat off of, say, Fury.
  • and finally, the length. I know it's ridiculously expensive as it is (and this is a weaker point for many reasons), but it's just flat out too short.
Raise the lift to 300ft, make the turnaround at least interesting, and tack on one or two more elements at the end and I'd (probably) have nothing but good things to say.
 
CoasterMac305 said:
  • The fact that there IS a debate whether it's a Giga in and of itself is the first point. Seriously couldn't've gone another 13 vertical feet?
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I don't care what the height is. It's taller than anything else in the park that guests can be at. You'll be up higher than you are on Drop Tower, Windseeker, Eiffel Tower, etc. The height doesn't affect the ride experience anyways, it's the drop that counts.
If the lift had been over 300 feet, everyone on here would have been pissed that Kings Island didn't use the terrain in a cool way. They used the terrain to their advantage and created a giga coaster.
Besides, you're not the general public. They will love this and that's the only thing that counts, not you splitting hairs. Cedar Fair knows what makes a great coaster and what makes a great giga coaster. This will be a great ride. Whether or not it's short in your eyes or whether the turnaround isn't "inspired" enough (I've never seen an element like it, I think it looks very cool) won't matter to literally anybody traveling to the park.
I get it, you hate B&M. If it's not an Intamin or RMC, what's the point?
 
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KIFan said:
Besides, you're not the general public. They will love this and that's the only thing that counts, not you splitting hairs.
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Yes but this is a coaster site for enthusiasts who aren't the general public. Just because the general public might love a ride doesn't mean we aren't allowed to say bad things about it. We know that parks don't cater to us but this argument is pointless in the context of this website.
 
Pear said:
Yes but this is a coaster site for enthusiasts who aren't the general public. Just because the general public might love a ride doesn't mean we aren't allowed to say bad things about it. We know that parks don't cater to us but this argument is pointless in the context of this website.
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Sure, but I don't think it's right to rip apart a ride that was not designed for you specifically in mind. Of course you're going to say you're not going to like it.
 
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