Innovative coaster models that never 'hit the big time'
- Thread starter CoasterCrazy
- Start date
CoasterfanSWE
Roller Poster
The Intamin Space Diver (even if many of the ideas are still utilized in B&M to this day).
Rob
Mega Poster
Just to dig something up...
As a solid Schwarzkopf fan, I will naturally bring myself to the fore here to defend the most influential company ever to have emerged into this industry (Bring on the debate
)....
The Jumbo V, being the final evolution of the 'Jet Star' and 'Wild Cat' range, was unfortunately, in my eyes, one of the few rides that was too little, too late. Being a 1983 design it was 15 years younger than it's older brothers and really boasted little more than technical improvements on the already well established Jet Star range. In terms of fair grounds, it offered a small footprint and reduced running costs but did it offer anything that would wow people? Unfortunately, the industry had shifted significantly in the 15 years since it's brethren emerged, technology was now looking at more elements, loops, launches; Schwarzkopf offered travelling coasters that did this, so the thrill seeker markets who would previously had stood in awe, looking at the twisted mess of a Jet Star, would likely pass off the Jumbo V as nothing. It almost has an identity crisis, where in the market does it fit? It's distinctively not a kiddie ride, but it's by no stretch of the imagination a thrill machine.
So, where is it's place, if it has one at all? I'd argue the latter, unfortunately. It was simply a ride harking back to the old days of G Force, G Force, G Force. It wasn't innovative, in the sense it had been done before, rather, it was refining the past rides, but to Schwarzkopf's disadvantage, they were quite reputable and their products of 10 years prior were going strong. There was no particular requirement to replace them, there was nothing added in the new design, and I think that's probably what caused the ride to be a relative flop. It was a perfect example of everything Schwarzkopf did well, everything they brought to the industry to propel it into the future, but it simply wasn't innovative or imaginative, and failed to grasp any form of market niche.
CoasterCrazy said:
Furie said:
As a solid Schwarzkopf fan, I will naturally bring myself to the fore here to defend the most influential company ever to have emerged into this industry (Bring on the debate
)....The Jumbo V, being the final evolution of the 'Jet Star' and 'Wild Cat' range, was unfortunately, in my eyes, one of the few rides that was too little, too late. Being a 1983 design it was 15 years younger than it's older brothers and really boasted little more than technical improvements on the already well established Jet Star range. In terms of fair grounds, it offered a small footprint and reduced running costs but did it offer anything that would wow people? Unfortunately, the industry had shifted significantly in the 15 years since it's brethren emerged, technology was now looking at more elements, loops, launches; Schwarzkopf offered travelling coasters that did this, so the thrill seeker markets who would previously had stood in awe, looking at the twisted mess of a Jet Star, would likely pass off the Jumbo V as nothing. It almost has an identity crisis, where in the market does it fit? It's distinctively not a kiddie ride, but it's by no stretch of the imagination a thrill machine.
So, where is it's place, if it has one at all? I'd argue the latter, unfortunately. It was simply a ride harking back to the old days of G Force, G Force, G Force. It wasn't innovative, in the sense it had been done before, rather, it was refining the past rides, but to Schwarzkopf's disadvantage, they were quite reputable and their products of 10 years prior were going strong. There was no particular requirement to replace them, there was nothing added in the new design, and I think that's probably what caused the ride to be a relative flop. It was a perfect example of everything Schwarzkopf did well, everything they brought to the industry to propel it into the future, but it simply wasn't innovative or imaginative, and failed to grasp any form of market niche.
Rob
Mega Poster
AND! I'll add at this point the real coaster I shed a tear for. The marvelous, beautiful, revolutionary and really really imaginative Maurer Sohne X car. It never hit the big time but it offered everything Intamin and B&M do, just with a lower height restriction, better seating (let the debate commence) and in a fine looking train.
I won't speak any more for it, just look at the sheer versatility of it:
http://www.maurer-rides.com/x-coaster/x-car/
Why this isn't one of the most widespread coasters around the world really does escape me.
I won't speak any more for it, just look at the sheer versatility of it:
http://www.maurer-rides.com/x-coaster/x-car/
Why this isn't one of the most widespread coasters around the world really does escape me.
Rob said:Nah, you slagged the whole range of products, couldn't be doing with that! (Ok, I exaggerate but we cannot miss the point that all the products prior were still revolutionary).
Yeah, I can't see any slagging off there at all. In fact, I don't think I was even slightly negative.
I can be if you like though?
No, I have a lot of respect for the early work of Anton and Stengel actually. They were massively innovative at the time and produced coasters which stood a long time as "great". It wasn't really until the B&M/Intamin revolution of the late 80's/early 90's that they really lost any ground in terms of ride quality and intensity.
Okay, Arrow and Vekoma were doing very different things along similar lines, but look at the likes of Pinfari who also dominated the arena at the time. You'd take a Wild Cat over a Zyklon every time :lol:
Their rides are the very best of that period, but considering most of the rides of that period we now consider complete turds*, it's not really a huge accolade
*actually, I still enjoy a lot of old Pinfari and Arrow/Vekoma rides - they're mild fun and I don't mind them. It's just that compared to the goodies we have today, they're turds.
Agreed about the X-Car coasters. They were such an exciting design, but G-Force isn't too great which was a shame.
Crazycoaster
Giga Poster
Rob said:
If you've ever been on G-Force, you'd know why.
jansolee66
Roller Poster
One of my favourite coasters, and the one that seems to get universally positive reviews since it was installed, is Vortex, an Arrow suspended coaster (like The Big Bad Wolf), at Canada's Wonderland. Most of these are or will be torn down due to operation costs and Arrow's closure, so I don't expect to see them again, but I'm amazed that no one else ever latched on the the suspended "swinging" coaster idea, whereas Vekoma SLCs are everywhere. The swing factor is so unique that the ride still feels relatively modern and really fast despite being 20+ years old and only going ~55MPH.
The Togo shuttle coaster seems like a concept that could have been experimented with a lot more than it ever was (those super tight heartline rolls are pretty cool).
This is a slight departure from the topic:
The Wild Mouse concept has been around forever and I understand why (don't take up much room, accessible to a big audience). I always wondered why parks, with the proper geography never considered building one on the side of a hill or something along those lines which would allow most of the track to be higher than the typical 40-50ft. I don't know why, but I have a feeling that a 100' (or even just 75') tall wild mouse would be legitimately scary.
The Togo shuttle coaster seems like a concept that could have been experimented with a lot more than it ever was (those super tight heartline rolls are pretty cool).
This is a slight departure from the topic:
The Wild Mouse concept has been around forever and I understand why (don't take up much room, accessible to a big audience). I always wondered why parks, with the proper geography never considered building one on the side of a hill or something along those lines which would allow most of the track to be higher than the typical 40-50ft. I don't know why, but I have a feeling that a 100' (or even just 75') tall wild mouse would be legitimately scary.
jansolee66
Roller Poster
Megaton - Mitsui Greenland
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEkkQus9Zcw[/youtube]
Looks very cool but certainly seems like there is a lot of room to grow, design-wise
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEkkQus9Zcw[/youtube]
Looks very cool but certainly seems like there is a lot of room to grow, design-wise
roomraider
Best Topic Starter
Speaking of pipelines Togo built a model of a duelling pipeline coaster that could turn (it banked to 90degrees and pulled a vertical turn on its side essentially) The ride looked a bit like Racer at Kings island in footprint terms. There used to be a picture of the model at an old IAAPA on the site Coasterglobe.com but now that site is defunct I've never found it again
CanobieFan
Strata Poster
While I'd hate to link to TPR.... google pulled this up - http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/fi ... 0883_1.jpg
Its the same model but not showing the turnaround well
Edit - I guess I should have looked a bit harder. Here's the turn around - http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/files/dsc_0913.jpg
Also, it should be noted that for a while Premier was offering the Ultra Twister still for a while, they kinda took over Togo when they closed up shop.
Its the same model but not showing the turnaround well
Edit - I guess I should have looked a bit harder. Here's the turn around - http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/files/dsc_0913.jpg
Also, it should be noted that for a while Premier was offering the Ultra Twister still for a while, they kinda took over Togo when they closed up shop.
andrus
Giga Poster
Explenation please! Why aren't they any good? Are they rough?gavin said:
Looking at this youtube clip below of Sky Coaster at Dream World in Bangkok I have to say it look bloody brilliant! The exposed seats make this type of ride a lot more thrilling, imagine a layout like Eagle Fortress but with those Vekoma trains instead?! :--D
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41DxDKG9yf8[/youtube]
^I've ridden the one in Bangkok and the one in Belgium. They're the same ride, but for some reason I preferred the one in Bangkok.
The problem is that the layouts are quite dull. It's just a bunch of helices, so you don't really get much of a swing at all, though you do pick up quite a bit of speed at times.
There's potential there though I think. There was a rumour going round a couple of years ago that Everland were looking to get these trains on Eagle Fortress, similar to what Chessington did with Vampire. Obviously, it never happened, but it could've been interesting.
The problem is that the layouts are quite dull. It's just a bunch of helices, so you don't really get much of a swing at all, though you do pick up quite a bit of speed at times.
There's potential there though I think. There was a rumour going round a couple of years ago that Everland were looking to get these trains on Eagle Fortress, similar to what Chessington did with Vampire. Obviously, it never happened, but it could've been interesting.
ciallkennett
Strata Poster
Unless I missed it, nobody has thus far mentioned the S&S Free Fly coaster.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQRN3KJzCTI[/youtube]
I haven't ridden it, and seeing S&S attached to anything is often a curse, but visually they look brilliant and the possibility of having a relatively unique family coaster experience is there. I'm sure there are many reasons why they just haven't taken off (if anybody knows why I'd be interested to hear).
Otherwise, I can see Mega-Lite's continue to be built. They're not for everybody, but I don't see why a small or moderate sized park with the right budget wouldn't approach Intamin to seek a thrilling coaster of good size to bump up their ride selection and pull in a wider range of guests. They're off the shelf Intamin designs, so unless the coaster is pulled completely from Intamin's range, I'm sure they'd continue manufacturing it.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQRN3KJzCTI[/youtube]
I haven't ridden it, and seeing S&S attached to anything is often a curse, but visually they look brilliant and the possibility of having a relatively unique family coaster experience is there. I'm sure there are many reasons why they just haven't taken off (if anybody knows why I'd be interested to hear).
Otherwise, I can see Mega-Lite's continue to be built. They're not for everybody, but I don't see why a small or moderate sized park with the right budget wouldn't approach Intamin to seek a thrilling coaster of good size to bump up their ride selection and pull in a wider range of guests. They're off the shelf Intamin designs, so unless the coaster is pulled completely from Intamin's range, I'm sure they'd continue manufacturing it.