Obesity

[nadroJ]

So, we did a case study today on Coca-Cola, who are under attack for putting out a video that basically defends themselves against the whole Coke=obese debate. They've been heavily criticised for not making the health issues caused by Coke products clear, and sort of skirting around the issue.

I've never seen an ad where Coke pretends it's stuff is good for you though, so I don't really understand what the problem is. They're portraying their product in a good light, of course they are, that's how advertising works! Basically, what is being predicted is that soft drinks will go the same way of cigarettes in the coming years.

Now, I think this is totally unfair to Coke, and any company that sells unhealthy stuff. We KNOW it's unhealthy, I doubt anybody ever sits there and thinks they're getting any nutritional value from Coke. We are aware that it's bad for us. That's why most of us don't drink it every god damn day. Yes, there ARE people who choose to do this, and these people also choose to eat a lot of unhealthy food too, leading to obesity. What Coke are being condemned for is contributing to the obesity epidemic, merely by being very good at advertising their products, which to me is wrong. A massive part of the Western ideology is democracy, and the freedom to choose. In my eyes, we make our choices and suffer the consequences. By basically calling for the choice to consume these unhealthy (yet delicious <3) products to be taken away, surely that infringes our right to make our own choices, and basically being told we are too stupid to make healthy choices.

Which I believe is the case with most people. I don't think people suffer from a lack of education about this stuff, which is an argument always put forward. Maybe that was the case 10-20 years ago, but surely by now everybody must know that this stuff sucks for our bodies. Therefore, we make the choice to consume it in spite of this, hence it is our own fault if we become obese/unhealthy because of this, not because the company is shoving it in our faces all the time.

So, do you agree, what are your views, blah blah blah.

 

[furie]

I think the information is out there, but people don't actually realise (or want to accept) the reality of the situation.

A "medium" coke from McDonalds with your meal is about a meal's worth of calories for a woman. If you put "18% of your daily intake" then people ignore it, you need to add things up and work it out.

If you say "drink this, and that means you don't have anything for dinner", people would perhaps understand things a little more. I don't know though, people just simply don't seem to understand how many calories are in a Coke.

Is it Coke's fault people are stupid? No. Would it be fair for Coke to be forced to put "drinking this will give you a monstrous camel toe like a beluga whale" on their ads to "educate people"? No.

Should perhaps Coke be pushing Diet Coke over regular Coke in a slow campaign to try and get people to drink more diet Coke? Yes, probably. Maybe if they rebranded completely and put Diet Coke in Red bottles/cans and full lard coke in puke green packaging, it may help. People will associate the red with the ordinary Coke and just move over.

It's that, or they need to be reducing sugar content (or the corn syrup) in their products slowly so that they reach much more acceptable levels.

The problem of course, is that you can't just pick on Coke. If you did, then they would start to become less competitive unless EVERY brand of Cola drink was forced down this route.

I don't know if anybody has noticed, but over the last year or so, products like Sprite and 7-Up in the UK have been replaced with just sugar free "diet" variants in most places? You can still get full-lard versions, but it's more common place now to find the "Free" version as your only option. This may be testing the waters with less popular products where there was never choice anyway between diet and fatty, so I don't know if they will move to replace things or not? I'd hope so, because people aren't responsible enough for their own dietary well being, and that's certainly speaking personally :lol:

 

[nadroJ]

Should perhaps Coke be pushing Diet Coke over regular Coke in a slow campaign to try and get people to drink more diet Coke? Yes, probably. Maybe if they rebranded completely and put Diet Coke in Red bottles/cans and full lard coke in puke green packaging, it may help. People will associate the red with the ordinary Coke and just move over.

It's that, or they need to be reducing sugar content (or the corn syrup) in their products slowly so that they reach much more acceptable levels.

The rebranding thing would be amazing but Coke would never do it, even the silver Diet Coke cans just have too many connotations for such a powerful brand image.

And apparently they've decreased the amount of sugar in their products by 22%, according to them. But note that that says 'their products' and not Coke itself ;] The video we watched was basically Coke going 'hey, don't just blame us, there are lots of factors in this!' It was kind of sad to see such a massive brand like that in a desperate defensive situation, all because people are too dumb to NOT drink 6 litres of Coke per day or whatever it is that the hippos on Channel 4 programmes claim to drink.

 

[Lottie.]

I think the information is out there, but people don't actually realise (or want to accept) the reality of the situation.

Pretty much this ^

It is a shame that Coke have to defend themselves when they are not the sole brand for obesity. I always think that it is people's choices if they want to eat/drink unhealthy stuff, but that a healthier option is available such as Diet Coke etc.

 

[SaiyanHajime]

I don't know if anyone will agree, but I think the way people are ignorant about the unhealthiness of a product like coke is very similar to the way people are ignorant about spending money, and both are intertwined.

My relationship with soda is unusual, as is my relationship with money, and I don't think that's a coincidence but a product of my personality. I very, very, very rarely drink soda compared to most people. I go weeks without it and even then I'll have maybe one glass, or occasionally go through a faze where I drink "a lot" (a 2L over a few days). My soda consumption is increased massively whenever it's "free" (comes with a meal, free refills, from someone else, etc), because half my issue with it is how damn expensive it is. I always carry a bottle of water with me, but if I have to buy a drink because I'm thirsty because mine has run out or I don't have it for some reason, typically I'll buy something other than water because I object paying for it. Ribena is a favourite, and I've noticed a lot of people who are "concious" of their weight or the unhealthiness of soda, somehow think Ribena or Oasis is any better.

I hate diet sodas, not only do they taste disgusting, but they give me bowel trouble and I highly doubt the synthetic sweetener is any better for you than any sugar, even high fructose corn syrup.

Why do people drink coke, or anything? I think in a lot of situations, it's a feeling that they have to. The idea of getting water at a restaurant is frowned upon.

It's hard to comprehend the calorific content of a liquid, especially because you don't actually get much enjoyment from it. It's not like food, where you're chewing it and the flavour fades and then you pass it down. You get only a smidgen of the taste from a sugary drink before it continues down your throat.

I don't think it's cokes fault, but then I don't think payday loans are at fault either, and I fail to see any distinction. Coke abuses people's ignorance, or lack of a ****, in the same way a loan company does or cigarettes do. To think that educating people would make them stop is sillyness... If those vile photos on cigarettes don't do the job, would a photograph of the amount of sugar in your coke with big bold lettering telling you that this is a meals worth of calories REALLY help?

I have a can of mountain Dew here, and I have far less care for it's 170 calories that contribute to the flavour, than I do for the caffeine content which is absolutely irrelevant to it. And vegetable oil?? Why on earth is there vegetable oil?? I have no issue with stuff being bad for you if it's the only way to make the product, but I canot fathom the introduction of ingredients which are so unhealthy but non essential. Throwback Pepsi, for example, with it's "real" sugar, doesn't taste right to me. And you can't make a donut without excessive rehydrogenated vegetable oils, but why a cake needs them in place of butter is beyond me.

 

[LiveForTheLaunch]

ANY person is stupid who wants to blame a corporation for the fact that they're a fattie. Whether it's Coke or McDonalds, everyone knows it's bad for their health, yet if they want to continuously indulge in it then the corporation can hardly be blamed. I like certain types of pop (not so much Coke though) and there are times, like Joey, I will drink it when it's free or available, such as when I am at work and we get it free; however, even then I only have about half a kid's cup of it because I KNOW it's bad and I KNOW if I drink too much of it I'll gain weight. Nobody can be ignorant enough to not realize the health implications that excessive pop or fast food will have on their body. Same with McDonalds.. I have access to it at 50% off anytime, and direct access whenever I'm at work, yet I'm not one of those people who take advantage of the fact that it's convenient and tastes good. Once a week? Sure. Twice a week? On occassion. Three or more times? That's asking to get fat.

No one is forcing Coke or fast food down anyone's throat. Even if you feel the need to eat fast food, there's nothing stopping anyone from the healthy options. So yes, it comes to individual choice. If companies were stuffing secret fat juice into their products and not telling people about it then sure, it's their fault, but that isn't the case.

 

[nadroJ]

I don't get why the companies are being penalised for what is inherently just bad decision making on unhealthy people's parts. Like 'ohhh I'm fat because of all the advertising and it's always in my face!' You still have to make the decision to purchase and consume this stuff. Like for instance, earlier I was leaving Uni around lunchtime and heading home, I was fairly hungry. On my way to the train station I walk past a McDonalds AND a Subway, both of which I swear to god pump out the concentrated smell of their food to intoxicate you and entice you inside. And believe me, I was stood there thinking I want a Subway right now so bad. But then I was like, well I'm heading home now, I'll be there in less than an hour, there's food at home that I can have as much as I want of and it's free. It's just a simple question of willpower, which I believe lots of people simply don't have, and instead of owning up to this and dealing with it they'd rather just blame the big corporations for selling the stuff that made them fat in the first place.

 

[Snoo]

The reality of the situation is, like mentioned, people don't care or are too stupid to realize whats bad for them. Of course, the overpopulation of **** things at half the price compared to good things at double the price doesn't help the situation either.

 

[furie]

If companies were stuffing secret fat juice into their products and not telling people about it then sure, it's their fault, but that isn't the case.

Coke kind of are with the corn syrup. It's the most unhealthy form of sugar you can consume - but, that's kind of the bottom of the list of issues within the Cocoa Cola Corp to be fair

I don't know if anyone will agree, but I think the way people are ignorant about the unhealthiness of a product like coke is very similar to the way people are ignorant about spending money, and both are intertwined.

I think I know what you mean Joey. I think that we're psychologically unbalanced in that we don't like to be told not to do something we enjoy. We can always make excuses and the easiest person to lie to about these things is yourself. So people will always do things which are bad for them simply because they enjoy it, and damn the consequences; "it's not like it's really that bad" [/thingsyousaytoyourselftoexscusebehaviour]

Ribena is a favourite, and I've noticed a lot of people who are "concious" of their weight or the unhealthiness of soda, somehow think Ribena or Oasis is any better.

I agree. I don't quite get it either. Though I think (I'd have to check) a carton of Ribena has about 100 calories or something, compared to a bottle of Coke with 200+ Oasis is very high in sugar though.

I hate diet sodas, not only do they taste disgusting, but they give me bowel trouble and I highly doubt the synthetic sweetener is any better for you than any sugar, even high fructose corn syrup.

I used to think they tasted bad, but drank them anyway. Now ordinary full sugar drinks I find taste really nasty. It's just a case of getting your taste buds used to it.

You're right that the synthetic sweetener is bad for you (it makes me manic and twitchy if I have too much), but like fully fat Coke, it's all about keeping it limited. I drink soft drinks when I'm driving, or with a "daytime meal out and about". It's simply because it's more convenient or thirst quenching (or to make food easier to swallow) than coffee or tea.

I'm a caffeine addict, so Diet Coke is a perfect solution to feed my addiction and work as a drink. In the evenings, I only ever drink water - unless I need caffeine to keep me awake (late night drives) or beer because it's a beer night Though stupidly, beer is considerably worse for you than Coke - but it's not like I drink too much very often

Why do people drink coke, or anything? I think in a lot of situations, it's a feeling that they have to. The idea of getting water at a restaurant is frowned upon.

I always feel bad asking for a pitcher of water at a restaurant over here. It's like "just tap water please" gets you the "you tight arsed bastard" look - no wonder I never tip

I don't think it's cokes fault, but then I don't think payday loans are at fault either, and I fail to see any distinction. Coke abuses people's ignorance, or lack of a ****, in the same way a loan company does or cigarettes do. To think that educating people would make them stop is sillyness... If those vile photos on cigarettes don't do the job, would a photograph of the amount of sugar in your coke with big bold lettering telling you that this is a meals worth of calories REALLY help?

I think in some cases it can do. I agree that if somebody doesn't want to stop, they will always make an excuse to carry on (as discussed above). However, I really do think that some people just aren't really aware of how bad things are. Everyone knows smoking is bad for you, or pay day loans - but if you're addicted to fags or going to get kicked out of your house for not paying the rent - those two things suddenly become something you have very little control over, no matter the horror and scare stories.

If you don't mind the taste of diet and get no negative affects, then maybe some people would respond to a "this bottle of Coke is the same as eating this bag of chips" kind of 'education'.

 

[nadroJ]

In the video Coke also said that 'calories are calories, wherever they come from' which was really scrutinised. Coke is basically empty calories with virtually no nutritional value, whereas calories from say, a slice of pizza would at least come with some carbs, calcium, maybe some sort of vitamins from the tomato sauce. Of course it's mixed with a ton of other crap, but at least it's something. Empty calories have nothing to be broken down with and apparently makes it more difficult for your body to shift it or some crap.

 

[Intricks]

I do believe there is a small bit of fault (1% top) within the companies, but it is purely looking towards how they advertise their product. Granted you cant make your product look terrible to the consumer, but all Coke, Pepsi, McDonalds, Burger King, etc seem to use are skinny, healthy looking folk. It is like how cigarettes made you either someone to hang out with (Camel), or a manly man (Malboro). Hell, Coke uses Polar Bears and all this cutesy stuff that can be reminisce of Disney to sell its product (Bring the family together or some ****.....share the happiness?). While I wouldnt shout false advertisement (as skinny folks eat McDs and Polar Bears survive the harsh arctic climate with red scarves and drinking loads of Coke), I do believe they mislead just what exactly can happen.

Seriously, show a fatass family chomping away on some McDonalds, grease dribbling down their chins onto the bright colored spandex atrocity that can barely fit them....and I have a feeling people will look the other way when it comes to choosing what to eat.

The blame is near solely on the individual, but there is a very small minute amount of blame that can be placed on how the company advertises their product using a misleading image. Unfortunately, rather than people take blame for their own fatness (like I am), they would rather point the finger of blame elsewhere.

 

[nealbie]

I'm fat. I also like Coke. And food. It tastes good. I can offset being a lard arse by knowing I've enjoyed the food and am not so fat that I'm incapable of physical activity.

The end.

 

[kimahri]

All things in moderation is what I say. (after binging on a who load of chocolate and ****...)

 

[Ben]

A "medium" coke from McDonalds with your meal is about a meal's worth of calories for a woman

Since when has a coke had the same calories as a meal?

There's about 50 calories per 100ml of coke. So, 500ml, a standard amount, is 250cals. How is that a meal, omg.

 

[Youngster Joey]

One of the leading factors of childhood Obesity is Fruit Juice. Giving kids fruit juice instead of milk is a major issue since most fruit juice's are just as if not more sugary then soda.

As for in general it's really a mix of the two. Noting is Black and White, there is ALWAYS a gray area.

 

[tomahawk]

It's 99.9% on the person, the .1% on the company. That said, a lot of the blame on the person can be drawn back to genetics and stuff like that.

Hell, I'm fat, but I like food. It's not brain surgery to figure out what is bad for you. I drink way too much soda I know that, but I've switched from regular to the "10 calories" (or diet with more taste) and it makes a difference. Any fat person who blames a company for getting fat is just an absolute idiot. They didn't pry your mouth open and poor coke down your throat or shove big macs into your mouth. You order, you get what you order, and that's where the blame lies. Get a chicken sandwich, every place has them, or better yet, a salad.

 

[Youngster Joey]

^Interestingly enough Diet Soda is WAY worse for you if your drinking more than about 1 a day. Also I might just link to an essay I just wrote on this subject for college last semester. This issue tends to show political sides.

Today restaurants have to provide nutritional values, but 10 years ago they didn't. It now falls more on the person but there is more factors than just knowing what is good or bad for you. What if fast food is all you can afford?

 

[Gavin]

Coca Cola has been around in some form for over 100 years. Guess what? There wasn't suddenly an obesity epidemic in the back end of the 19th century.

Also guess what? A glass of Coke a day, while admittedly of zero nutritional value, isn't going to make you fat.

YOU'RE going to make you fat by guzzling the stuff in ridiculous quantities, while ramming all kinds of other **** down your throat, all from the comfort of the sofa you haven't moved from in days.

The blame culture that we have is getting ridiculous. I used to think it was an American thing, but it's more and more prevalent over here now as well. Too few people are willing to accept responsibility for their own **** ups and too quick to point the finger somewhere other than their own enormous gut.

Rant over.

 

[Smithy]

The blame culture that we have is getting ridiculous. I used to think it was an American thing, but it's more and more prevalent over here now as well. Too few people are willing to accept responsibility for their own **** ups and too quick to point the finger somewhere other than their own enormous gut.

Rant over.

This, a million million times.

So many **** idiots that have to be spoon fed every little bit of information. And if they're not, it's somebody else's fault.

 

[SaiyanHajime]

What you have to remember though Scarlet, is the problems with the industry you're describing are about health in general, not specifically obesity. It's still bad, but the obesity epidemic is fundamentally people's own faults.

Obesity is quite simply eating too much and moving too little. Plenty of people live off awful, processed crap, but they simply have sensible portion sizes.

I check packaging more often out of curiosity, and Scarlet is right. I've noticed here in the US, like I touched on previously, there's a whole lot of extra **** in stuff that isn't so prolific at home in the UK. And, not only that, it's easier to find affordable alternatives at home which are without the ****.

In Kroger I couldn't find a SINGLE loaf of normal bread that did not have High Fructose Corn Syrup in it. I didn't examine every brands ingredients, but I did pick a selection from cheap to expensive to ones which claim to be healthier. Even the in store baked breads had it! American bread is a sweet thing by default, thats how it comes.

At the health supermarkets, the cost is extortionate. We're talking like $6 for a loaf of normal, bog-standard bread comparable to something at home which are like £1-1.50, 2 at a push.

TONNES of stuff here has soy in it, the weirdest of things... At home it's typically only vegetarian marketed stuff that does.

It's ****, but I think preventing this legally is kind of ... morally wrong? People should be able to choose and companies able to make money from any product people invest in. The issue is with education and the demands of the public.

On the flip side, peanut butter in the US is more often than not JUST made with peanuts, with maybe added salt, unlike in the UK where that's hard to find. Fresh fruit and veg is not only affordable, but more varied and people eat less frozen produce.