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Thirteen's first drop

cp23

New Member
This may have been covered but I can't find it anywhere. Has the strength of the trims on Thirteen's first drop been increased at all recently? I may be imagining it (probably am) but I don't remember noticing them so much when I went on it in March, but at the weekend I really noticed them killing off a lot of the speed. A real shame I think, as that first section could be much better if it weren't trimmed.
 

A-Kid

Active Member
They were changed from large static plates to moveable plates. They can now be partly retracted for light trains.



You can sorta see the retractable ones here. The other section is like that too instead of the massive plate.

I guess they could be harder on or even grabbing softer depending on weight...
 

STC

Member
On the control panel they can instantly turn the trims on and off.

They did it so that at the end of the day they don't have to load two trains with weights to get the guests on the last two trains of the day off the ride.
 

cp23

New Member
Forgive me for my ignorance, but why can't they run it completely untrimmed? I feel the trims ruin the first drop :-(
 

STC

Member
cp23 said:
Forgive me for my ignorance, but why can't they run it completely untrimmed? I feel the trims ruin the first drop :-(
God knows. I remember it had a lot of problems with "overspeeding" into the second lift during the first few weeks, but it had the trims then. I think the trims are there to keep it at the right intensity for a "family coaster". :roll:
 

cp23

New Member
It's never been untrimmed, has it? It just seems ridiculous to market it as the 'ultimate roller coaster' etc. and then trim the first drop! Just as the first drop starts to really get going you feel the trims kick in :-( It'd be a great drop without them, especially in the back seats.
 

Morgan

New Member
I rode it a couple of times on Saturday and I didn't notice the trims on the first drop at all, can't say I ever have, sitting on the back row, you don't touch your seat all the way down, so I don't think they ruin the drop in anyway. The other trims are noticable, but you still get pops of airtime, so for me it's not an issue.
 

Nemesis Inferno

Well-Known Member
I think they changed the type of trim, or sommat like that...

Either way if many are to be believed the trim's effect on the train is proportional to the mass of said train...

It's still noticeable as hell though...
 

andrus

Active Member
It's a shame they built a new ride where they obviously planned to put trims on the first drop already on the blue prints. I can understand if you put trims along the track to reduce speed, but to have it on the first drop? Why not just make the drop lower instead??
 

Martyn B

Well-Known Member
I noticed there's a massive different depending on where you're sitting. When I sat at the front, I felt it heavily, however at the back, I didn't notice it so much.

Another question whilst we're on the subject, is there actually a trim on the second hill/incline? I know there's a trim on the main drop, then first hill/incline, but I'm not 100% on the second. There's definitely casing for a trim on there...
 

cp23

New Member
It's strange but I didn't notice the trim at all when I rode it in March, but felt it was very noticeable on the weekend. I notice the one on the drop far more than the one on the hill. Oh well. Maybe I just sat in a train full of heavier people this time round.
 

Tom G

Member
Forgive my ignorance but what are the trims (I assume from the conversation that slow the train down) and where abouts are they? All I can say is the drop felt a hell of a lot more intense after faster when I rode at the end of May for the first time, compared to how it felt when I last rode a couple of weeks ago.
 

Hixee

Flojector
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
^Trims, as the name suggests, are designed to trim a bit of speed off the train. They can't stop the train, only reduce the speed slightly. The point of this is to keep the forces in check basically. For example the trims on the B&M Hypers are designed to stop the train 'over-speeding' the hill, thus keeping the perfect floater. As an example, they can been seen on the up slope of this hill on Silver Star:

http://www.rcdb.com/1414.htm?p=12867

The trims on 13 are to generally reduce the speed of the ride to make the forces less intense. They can be seen on the first drop of the coaster in the picture posted above.

Generally trims aren't liked by enthusiasts because it reduces the forces. It's only a short description and I hope I've got most of it right, if not, I'm sure UC can clarify and expand if he feels the need to.
 

marc

Well-Known Member
I rode 13 the 1st day it opened when the trims were on full and it was not this fancy way of doing it.

I do want to ride it again with the new system to see if it is better like people have said.

But a lot of peoples views on here are from the opening day when the train slowed down so much it was stupid.
 

caffeine_demon

Well-Known Member
I realise it was always going to be a family coaster but:

1 - Just how intense would the drop be, untrimmed?
and
2 - would the untrimmed forward drop be more intense than the backwards section?
 

marc

Well-Known Member
Well it was never meant to be trimmed, had everyone got their sums correct in the 1st place it would not have needed them :)

But they are there and we just have to move on from it, as I said I have yet to ride with the new system anyway.
 

Brookes

Active Member
Forgive me for my ignorance, but why can't they run it completely untrimmed? I feel the trims ruin the first drop :(
Alton never wanted a ride that caused riders to be ejected from their seats as it is essentially a family coaster. Therefore it is run with trims to reduce the speed and therefore force which would cause ejection.

I rode it a couple of times on Saturday and I didn't notice the trims on the first drop at all, can't say I ever have, sitting on the back row, you don't touch your seat all the way down, so I don't think they ruin the drop in anyway. The other trims are noticable, but you still get pops of airtime, so for me it's not an issue.
I totally agree, you don't feel the trims on the first drop at all in the back row but sit in the front half of the train and you feel them grab a lot. And I think the trim on the hill isn't noticable at all, I have never felt it in 20 odd rides.

I think they changed the type of trim, or sommat like that...

Either way if many are to be believed the trim's effect on the train is proportional to the mass of said train...

It's still noticeable as hell though...
Yep, there were problems with the initial trims which resulted in the train being sent only half full. These were changed quite quickly as I'm aware though, so would not explain why they would be stronger now.

I realise it was always going to be a family coaster but:

1 - Just how intense would the drop be, untrimmed?
and
2 - would the untrimmed forward drop be more intense than the backwards section?
To be honest probably not that much, in the back row you've already flown over the top of the drop by the time the front hits the trim. I assume the trim is to reduce the forcefulness of the following turn and hill. And I don't understand what you mean by the second part, the backwards section is a simple helix that isn't taken with a lot of speed; it's not that intense.
 

Tom G

Member
Thanks Hixee, I have seen them around loads (but never noticed them on hills) and thought they were brakes that were capable of stopping the train if needed....ha ha.
 

CMonster

Active Member
Brookes said:
Alton never wanted a ride that caused riders to be ejected from their seats as it is essentially a family coaster. Therefore it is run with trims to reduce the speed and therefore force which would cause ejection.
Isn't that what the inside drop creates, a feeling of ejection? Or are you not talking about airtime and actually talking about being ejected from the car?
 

Brookes

Active Member
^Though you raise a good point, the inside drop does not create "airtime" as such. The inside drop is freefall and therefore does not provide said airtime experienced on airtime hills. The outside hills were trimmed to reduce the speed over these hills, and therefore negative g-force.
 
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