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Six Flags Fiesta Texas | Dr. Diabolical's Cliffhanger | B&M Dive Coaster | 2022

owentaylor121

Giga Poster
So it’s nowhere near big enough to be for a new ride, it's coming from the wrong place to be new track or supports, and it's been confirmed by the park GM to be parts for Superman.... and yet we're still going to talk about how it just might be the new coaster?

You were saying?…

In all seriousness though, it’s brilliant to see B&M trying something new and going beyond vertical, hopefully it adds some power back into the dive machines first drop again! I’m hoping it has the older style restraints but going from the concept art, it’s looking very unlikely, what’s a shame.
 

oriolat2

Giga Poster
7 seats wide? The single rider queue on this is going to be lit.

Also is that little airtime hill for real?
If SF is smart, they will do what Phantasialand does on Chiapas and split the line into different lines before batching people: groups with even number of guests, odd number, as well as single riders.

For some reason, this doesn't strike me as weird as Zamperla having rows of 3.
 

Youngster Joey

Strata Poster
I have to imagine the reason not to actually have it dive off the cliff are two fold.

One it's probably WAY more money to safely incorporate it onto the quarry wall and B&M's already aren't cheap so adding more money to the cost may not be ideal for Six Flags

Two and probably more relevant, there just isn't a ton of open space on the quarry wall they could use for another attraction. 3 of there other coasters use the quarry wall and the space that isn't being used for a cred is used for fireworks and other show related things (or so I've been informed) so without clearing out a ton of buildings and rides there just wasn't a place they could put this on the quarry.

all that said it's still a bummer cliffhanger doesn't hang you off a cliff, it just probably wasn't financially practical
 

Ries

Mega Poster
I like it. Nice colour scheme. Great theme.
Surprising layout. Especially the 270 degree zero-g-roll. 95 degree drop. That airtime hill.

I think after loads of great Vekoma's and Intamin's. This (with Monster) is some B&M to look forward too.
 

Fluorineer

Mega Poster
I like to see that B&M is freshening up their own concepts, but I must say that I find it a bit worrying how slow and cautious they are still being with that.

Beyond-vertical drops are fine and all, but Gerstlauer has a firm grip on this market, so firm that their claim of "world's steepest dive coaster" is just flat-out not the case if you consider HangTime a dive coaster. I am honestly a little worried that B&M is confusing variation with innovation.

So weird conclusion for me: looks like a great coaster, but I have no idea why you would buy this, given what the market has to offer.
 

Crazycoaster

Giga Poster
B&M arn’t trying to aim for the gimmick of World’s steepest with this, that’s not why this is interesting, it’s interesting because of airtime.

They’d have done this drop shaping to produce more sustained negative G’s for longer, rather than a 0G vertical drop. Along with what looks to be an ejector air hill, it shows that B&M are experimenting more with negative G force. Most B&M’s are designed to produce 0G on the airtime hills, with a rare foray into anything stronger on a couple of speed hills here and there.

I doubt B&M have anything to worry about, it’s a solid company that produces a few coasters a year which is enough to sustain them financially.
 

oriolat2

Giga Poster
B&M arn’t trying to aim for the gimmick of World’s steepest with this, that’s not why this is interesting, it’s interesting because of airtime.

They’d have done this drop shaping to produce more sustained negative G’s for longer, rather than a 0G vertical drop. Along with what looks to be an ejector air hill, it shows that B&M are experimenting more with negative G force. Most B&M’s are designed to produce 0G on the airtime hills, with a rare foray into anything stronger on a couple of speed hills here and there.

I doubt B&M have anything to worry about, it’s a solid company that produces a few coasters a year which is enough to sustain them financially.
I recall reading somewhere that B&M Dive Coasters are not technically vertical but something around 88º so as to make sure that the road wheels are touching the rails at all times during the drop. Well, I don't know how they are going to pull that off with a 95º drop.

B&M really know their market and don't really care about trends and what their competition really does, although in recent years we've seen them shift to a less traditional approach when it comes to layout (Fury 325, Banshee and Flying Dinosaur) and somehow increasing their intensity level without compromising guest comfort.

This addition's icing on the cake would be if the coaster featured OTSR instead of those vests! God I hate them!
 

bob_3_

Giga Poster
I like to see that B&M is freshening up their own concepts, but I must say that I find it a bit worrying how slow and cautious they are still being with that.

Beyond-vertical drops are fine and all, but Gerstlauer has a firm grip on this market, so firm that their claim of "world's steepest dive coaster" is just flat-out not the case if you consider HangTime a dive coaster. I am honestly a little worried that B&M is confusing variation with innovation.

So weird conclusion for me: looks like a great coaster, but I have no idea why you would buy this, given what the market has to offer.

Dive coasters are a massive hit with park goers though. They're imposing and proper spectacles watching your mates dangle over a huge drop. I've seen alot of videos circulate the "omg would you ride this?" viral videos of that Chinese dive coaster showing off the floorless aspect of it. They defo still get a buzz, and with them marketing it as "the steepest" I think they have a winner with their audience. They may not be too exciting with us, especially those of us that have had a dive coaster on our doorstep for almost 25 years, but it's a great for for this park.

On the other hand, some of the weirder elements of the ride I find fascinating. The colour choice, the strangely high up turn around after the zero-g and THAT hill. I do think the animation may be slightly off though (after seeing how choppy the POV video is) so I'm really excited to see how some of these elements turn out IRL.

All in all I'm really happy to see this, but I guess I'm just a B&M fan boy.

EDIT, Also Hixee, I totally find it funny too how out of all the coasters, this one gets the cliffhanger name. Is it gonna be the on major coaster in the park thats the FURTHEST away from the cliff? lol
 

Dar

Hyper Poster
It's an interesting trade-off; do you innovate like hell and put out amazing products that break every 5 minutes (or needs sections removing or re-profiling), or do you take your time and only put out a sparkly finished product that works(TM)?
 

Crazycoaster

Giga Poster
I recall reading somewhere that B&M Dive Coasters are not technically vertical but something around 88º so as to make sure that the road wheels are touching the rails at all times during the drop. Well, I don't know how they are going to pull that off with a 95º drop.
This is true with the original coasters, Oblivion and G5, but all of the dives since then have used spring loaded wheels and do have 90° drops.
 

Rupert

Mega Poster
I recall reading somewhere that B&M Dive Coasters are not technically vertical but something around 88º so as to make sure that the road wheels are touching the rails at all times during the drop. Well, I don't know how they are going to pull that off with a 95º drop.
Wasn’t this in the earliest iterations before B&M had come up with spring-loaded bogies to keep the wheels against the track? I’m sure someone more knowledgeable can correct but I thought it was only the first couple of DMs that couldn’t be completely vertical. EDIT: @Crazycoaster got there first!

It’s nice to see B&M pushing the tiniest toe out of their comfort zone, but I agree with @TheCoasterCruiser, @Fluorineer and others that this is hardly innovative. This is coming 18 years after the first Eurofighter with a 97° drop, and who knows how many years after Intamin and others started building ight-radius negative G airtime hills. This is no different to them building Thunderbird decades after the first launched coaster was created.

Great to see them add a little variation to their offering, but I still really want to see them create something actually new and innovative and interesting. This is the same company that created the invert and the flying coaster (well at least turned made them into genuinely viable, comfortable and thrilling intense rides). Bring on the surf coaster I guess!

I think the coaster will be completely fine and a good addition to the park and has a pretty good layout. Big shame about the momentum-killing MCBR although at this kind of park throughput is king so makes sense - I just think that Valkyria has such a nice flowing layout that’s a joy to ride, I would have liked similar here.

A minor thing I really like (beyond the obviously great airtime hill) is the downward helix at the end, it should be a great, forceful finale. Whenever B&M do one of their upward helices into a brake run, slowing down before you get to the brakes, it kind of ends the rides a little before it needs to. The downward high speed turns that pin you back into your seat right at the end really round out the experience nicely (Raptor at CP has a great one), especially when coupled with a pop of airtime before hitting the brakes.
 

CrashCoaster

Strata Poster
This is true with the original coasters, Oblivion and G5, but all of the dives since then have used spring loaded wheels and do have 90° drops.
Not true. Firstly all B&Ms have spring-loaded wheel bogies, they were one of the first companies to produce them. And secondly, all of the 6-seater dives with the exception of I believe Emperor and Valkyria (and possibly Flying Apsaras?) have 87° drops. All of the larger dives do have a 90° drop, besides Oblivion and G5 as you mentioned.
 
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gavin

Administrator
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Social Media Team
Regarding the beyond vertical thing, I think this will ride better than the others, and not just because it's B&M.

If you look at the Eurofighters, the drop goes beyond vertical pretty much immediately. You don't get airtime so much as a sensation of just falling into the restraints.

With this, you get a decent bit of 90° fall first before it slightly dips inwards. You should get that B&M dive drop sensation first before getting pulled out of the seat when it goes beyond vertical.
 

Furiustobaco

Mega Poster
This looks really good! Please though B&M, DO NOT put vests on this. Valravn's drop is dreary due to them, if this thing has airtime it will be severly crippled with those vests. If it doesn't, it may be actually be a truely great coaster.
 
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