What's new

Phantasialand | F. L. Y. | Vekoma Launched Flying Coaster

Pokemaniac

Mountain monkey
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
That said, we 'lost' everything prior to the forum upgrade 2008/09(?), there were some absolute monsters back in the day. Maverick in particular, as there was so little known about the coaster (and therefore tons of speculation and hype) AND it was back before social media was big enough to hold most of the traffic - the golden age of forums! I recall that one being up around 200 pages.
I thought it was even way longer than that. Then again, Maverick opened was right before I joined, so I never participated in it. But the impression I got from it in later years was that it contained such an amount of ****posting at times that it approached 1000 pages. That could have been an exaggeration, however.

It's a shame that arcive.org hasn't catalogued the subforums here. Only the main page, where you can't see the thread counts.
 

Hixee

Flojector
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Social Media Team
Ah, waybackmachine! Screengrab from the forums on 15th October 2007:


Maverick had 4769 posts, spanning 341 pages. Although this is as the forums were laid out back then, averaging about 14 posts/page. Nowadays we're around 20 posts/page, so Maverick would be about 240 pages in the current layout.

Still, FLY is small-fry compared to either. :p
 

JammyH

Member
Neither have you, yet you (and many others) keep defending it and calling it world class. It might look awesome compared to Six Flags standards, but Rookburghs details are currently way below the standards Phantasialand has set in the past 10 years for itself. You have tall, mostly just painted walls on the outside, that's it. Compare this to Klugheim or Chiapas which feature lots of details on the walls to make them look less bland. Sure, Rockwork is easier for a vibrant look, but buildings can also feature plenty of details. Rookburgh lacks these for the most part and it does not look like Phantasialand is going to change it. Just look at the rusty wall on the outside. The inside looks better, but better does not mean good. And the amount of money spend is not neccessary related to the quality of the work. Universal Rocks isn't cheap, but if you tell them to build a bland wall, they are going to do it.

The Steampunk topic does not appear to be featured at all in its current state, its more a random industrial theme. Maybe the details are coming in later and I will look stupid afterwards, but looking at Klugheim, I have little hope that they are going to touch those walls again.

I don't want to hate on Rookburgh just to be against the mainstream, I just want to give some critical points as most people seem to think that Phantasialand is going to deliver perfect theming. They never have in the past, quite the opposite, they left huge holes in the theming, and Rookburgh will likely feature them as well. Just think about the Green Wall in Klugheim. Or the painted concrete walls in Tarons queue.
First of all, to make extravagant claims that Rookburgh's details are below Phantasialand's standards are simply ridiculous. None of us on here have actually been inside the area so none of us know the current state of the detail, progression and theming inside the area. You are so quick to criticise everyone who remains optimistic, but I know for a fact that this area will emulate detail and be just as immersive as everyone single one of Phantasialand's areas.

How do I know that? Because I have the Rookburgh gazette right next to me.

The concept art in the Rookburgh gazette emulates the level of detail that this themed area is going to have when this area finally comes to life for the public. No other park, has ever produced a newspaper to my knowledge, with such high level of detail as the Rookburgh gazette. The concept art in the Rookburgh gazette emulates the extreme level of detail and theming this themed world is going to have. So much effort wouldn't be put into the concept art and the gazette if we were all going to walk into this area and go "yeah this is a bit crap really isn't it". This is Phantasialand we are talking about, every other project in the last significant amount of time has had extreme level of detail, theming and created a truly immersive atmosphere. It's not one of merlin's last minute projects, it's a project that has been four years in construction and years more in planning and design.

Regarding comments that the detail and design we have seen so far doesn't fit into the "steampunk" theme, the theme of Rookburgh will have its own identity and its own character, it shouldn't just be generalised into a "steampunk" theme. That would be like categorising klugheim as a "medieval" theme. Klugheim has it's own identity, personality and theming which is what makes it such a unique themed area, I have no doubt that Rookburgh will be any different. Reading the Rookburgh gazette starts to give us an insight into the storyline behind the area showing us some of the characters, the fashion and the theming of the different shops and restaurants. But all of these storylines are best explained by actually being immersed into the themed area itself, hopefully something we will all be able to experience in the near future.

Regarding the walls. Klugheim isn't categorised as a "bad themed area" just because of the huge green metal wall by Taron's extension queueline. Yes, this wall is ugly, but it doesn't make klugheim ugly or not immersive as a whole. Similarly the large rust wall at the entrance to the hotel may not be appealing to everyone, but it's not going to make Rookburgh ugly as a whole, I'm confident the rest of the area will make up for it (relating back to concept art in the gazette). And we all know Phantasialand aren't concerned about first impressions.

You may not like the rest of the walls in Rookburgh, but the park needed a sufficient sound barrier to block out the noise that the area is going to make so the neighbours aren't so disturbed. I personally really like the detail from the rest of the walls so far and think when standing in the area it's going to make you feel really small with these towering walls around you. I'm confident that when standing down in the area itself that the walls will have more layers, theming pieces and props which really surround you in an immersive atmosphere. The fantasy wall on the other side of the area looks brilliant, I am hopeful that when in the area itself these walls will also really immerse you into Rookburgh, and will be like giant facades with various different shops and themed buildings incorporated into the walls.

Anyway, to summarise, the concept art looks absolutely fab, and combined with Phantasialand's experience and track record, I am very confident this is going to be a very successful and immersive themed area. I will eat my hat if I'm wrong, but I don't think there's many other parks outside of universal and Disney who can compete with Phantasialand when it comes to detail and theming. I see no reason why this would be any different. Years of planning and preparation, thousands of euros spent and very detailed concept art and successful marketing campaign. I have no doubts that the experience of Rookburgh will live up to the very high standards of Phantasialand.
 

Trax

Member
None of us on here have actually been inside the area so none of us know the current state of the detail, progression and theming inside the area. You are so quick to criticise everyone who remains optimistic, but I know for a fact that this area will emulate detail and be just as immersive as everyone single one of Phantasialand's areas.
So you have never been in there either, yet my critique (which is undermined by several pictures and/videos from the area) is invalid as I have not entered the area in person, but praising it in its current state is fine.

How do I know that? Because I have the Rookburgh gazette right next to me.
I have not seen the Green Wall, the bored piles or the blank concrete in the artwork for Klugheim. The Artwork is meant to give an idea how it is supposed to look, and will focus on the features they want to include.

Regarding comments that the detail and design we have seen so far doesn't fit into the "steampunk" theme,[...]. That would be like categorising klugheim as a "medieval" theme.
Sounds fine, Klugheim feels pretty medieval to me.

Regarding the walls. Klugheim isn't categorised as a "bad themed area" just because of the huge green metal wall by Taron's extension queueline.
It's not bad themed, but this alone disqualifies the area as world class. Immersion is very fragile and you have to remain consistent in the kind of theming, so the world you are trying to build appears real. A huge Green Metal wall will break any immersion as soon as it's seen. Same goes for dark concrete walls, if the other walls in the area are handcrafted and highly detailed. It will still look good, and even world class in some places, but the immersion will be broken in places, so the whole area gets dragged down by a few oversights.

You may not like the rest of the walls in Rookburgh, but the park needed a sufficient sound barrier to block out the noise that the area is going to make so the neighbours aren't so disturbed.
I do not complain about the existence of a wall, but the look of it. Yes, walls are hard to conceal, but it's possible. Chiapas is build around one giant wall which does not feel out of place at all, Klugheim has the rockwork as noise protection.

I have no doubts that the experience of Rookburgh will live up to the very high standards of Phantasialand.
Thats were we differ: My hypetrain got derailed years ago, after I looked a little closer than the average guest. I am not talking about the details, you only see after 100 visits, but things you blend out when you just walk by 1 or 2 times a year. I really want the area to live up to all your expectations, but I don't see Phantasialand keeping the level up.
Upon closer inspection, Klugheim feels like a downgrade in quality from Chiapas, and Rookburgh currently seems like a downgrade from Klugheim. My main concern (as all of you had guessed) are the huge walls, surrounding the whole area. They look random, bare and claustrophobic. Latter one would not be an issue, but if you want everything to feel tight and claustrophobic, you shouldn't have a hole in the center with the size of a rollercoaster.

Just to be clear: I want to hit the break on all of you hypetrains, but not derail it. I just want you to have slightly more realistic expectations. Maybe I am more negative since I have seen most of it in person and pictures don't to the area justice. I expcect FLY to be a good ride with a very good flight experience, as the layout has some great looking interactions with the surroundings (hoping that it rides glass smooth to create the feeling of flight), but I only expcect Rookburgh to be a decent looking area. Not bad, not terrible. They tried.
It would be great if Phantasialand blows me out of the water when I enter the area, but as of now my expectations are quite low.
 

Peter Immelmann

New Member
It's not bad themed, but this alone disqualifies the area as world class. Immersion is very fragile and you have to remain consistent in the kind of theming, so the world you are trying to build appears real. A huge Green Metal wall will break any immersion as soon as it's seen. Same goes for dark concrete walls, if the other walls in the area are handcrafted and highly detailed. It will still look good, and even world class in some places, but the immersion will be broken in places, so the whole area gets dragged down by a few oversights.
To some extend I agree. However, I'd just like to add for consideration that the fragility you mention is after all somewhat subjective and very much depends on what you're willing or used to tolerate. I also don't like the concrete tunnel and I'd prefer some more rock over the green wall, but it does not drag down the whole thing for me. I mean, just for the sake of taking a widened perspective on the subject: The mere presence of the crowd of visitors and, well, of the rollercoaster with its track and supports obviously breaks the perfect illusion that you were, say, in an old norse cultures' village (in the case of Klugheim). So you'd never be perfect.
 

Rupert

New Member
But I think it’s also fair to say that the presence of crowds, and other movement like the coaster trains flying above, smoke from chimneys, turning cogs and pistons, all really help to bring life to an area that is currently hard to see.

Until we see the area from ground level, whether in promotional material or in person, we’re not really going to know how effective the theming and immersion and atmosphere are.
 

Matt N

Well-Known Member
Ah, waybackmachine! Screengrab from the forums on 15th October 2007:


Maverick had 4769 posts, spanning 341 pages. Although this is as the forums were laid out back then, averaging about 14 posts/page. Nowadays we're around 20 posts/page, so Maverick would be about 240 pages in the current layout.

Still, FLY is small-fry compared to either. :p
How did you manage to find these @Hixee? As there are a fair few construction threads older than 2009 that I’d love to have a look at!

I had a look on the Wayback Machine myself, and the earliest record I could find was 2014...
 

Hixee

Flojector
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Social Media Team
How did you manage to find these @Hixee? As there are a fair few construction threads older than 2009 that I’d love to have a look at!

I had a look on the Wayback Machine myself, and the earliest record I could find was 2014...
I'll PM ya. :)
 

Ethan

Well-Known Member
I know for a fact that this area will emulate detail and be just as immersive as everyone single one of Phantasialand's areas.
The hypocrisy in this thread is hilarious. You attack others for critiquing the area, saying there's no way we'd know yet, but then you make just as bold of a statement yourself. You really do make me laugh.

The concept art in the Rookburgh gazette emulates the level of detail that this themed area is going to have when this area finally comes to life for the public. No other park, has ever produced a newspaper to my knowledge, with such high level of detail as the Rookburgh gazette.
Adorable that you think good marketing always means a good final product.

I personally really like the detail from the rest of the walls so far and think when standing in the area it's going to make you feel really small with these towering walls around you. I'm confident that when standing down in the area itself that the walls will have more layers, theming pieces and props which really surround you in an immersive atmosphere.
Right...

You have every right to this positive opinion on the theming. I encourage you to continue being positive and maintain your opinions. But can I ask, why can you make these assumptions, but others can't?

You say it'll look good from the inside. Others, myself included, think that the walls and general area will look flat and somewhat questionable. You have not been inside the area yourself, nor have we? So can I please ask you, and the others saying it, to stop attempting to silence people with the "you haven't been inside yet" argument, as this argument means you can't have an opinion either.
 

HarmL98

New Member
I just want to say I really admire what you guys are doing - trying to beat the longest thread record (thanks for the meticulous research @Hixee!) by having a ridiculously long and pointless debate/argument - good work! ;)
Sorry? Then we better close the forum. Because everyone can share their opinion, so they may not like something. And yes most of you get excited as soon as there is a concrete wall painted brown. And we have a critical opinion about that. And you can like it or dislike it. That doesn't matter. I think many here are a little too much in their "Phantasy" world with this project. I prefer to look at what we have. And there are good things and bad things (and very bad things). And thinks it should be negotiable. Thats how it works on a forum..
 
Top