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Cedar Point | Valravn | B&M Dive Machine

Intricks

Strata Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Which is why I am wondering if they may make this a more compact than a normal Dive Machine rather than something long and very drawn out as most are normally.

Honestly, while it would seem like an odd move to us (surprised nobody has mentioned Rougarou and the fact that the trains may possibly be floorless ;) ), maybe they have a real need for one. If they go with this proposal though (they never said they wwre, just that it was one of several that CP was looking at), I see it being fairly different in the layout than what we have seen so far.

When you add in Wicked Twister, Maverick and TTD, those are still a different ride experience than a Dive Machine. Griffon didnt feel anything like TTD or Maverick, and the ONLY way Wicked Twoster would be comparable here would be if it were the lsyout of Posessed and had the stop on the back spire. Twister and Dragster have more in common than Dragster and a Dive Machine.

Since nothing has been confirmed, we could also speculate on the odd-man out from the memo picture that was tweeted last year that house the RMC Conversion of Mean Streak. Coupling that with the fact that RMC has come out and stated that other parkz than Six Flags will be utilizing the I-Beam tech come 2016/17, we have two valid candidates for their upcoming attraction. Plus, wouldn't the conversion of Mean Streak be within that $15mil window range if we go with the assumption of that noted figure being their budget?
 

Hyde

Matt SR
Staff member
Moderator
Social Media Team
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Well, did some additional research - Sheikra cost $13.5 million and Griffon cost $15.6 million.

Large-scale B&M Dive Machine = back to plausible. (At least from a cost perspective)

Also, the Sandusky Register published a follow-up article, going more in depth on memo details: http://www.sanduskyregister.com/enterta ... ls/7372776

I went ahead and gleaned sections of the article that discuss ride details.

The Sandusky Register said:
The proposed Dive Coaster has three 24-passenger trains. Each train has eight people seated in a row, with each person restrained by a shoulder harness.

B&M is designing into the ride, a vertical drop in a tunnel, an Immelmann, a 270-degree roll, a banked curve, a "looping," an Immelmann with a half-roll exit, a second drop, a camel back and a spiral with a total of four inversions, according to the memo.

...

The height of the lift in the proposal is about 223 feet above ground level. The length of the track of about 3,625 feet, according to the memo. The proposed Dive Coaster has a maximum speed of about 80 mph with a ride lasting about 195 seconds, including 30 seconds for loading and unloading of passengers. At that rate 1,310 guests per hour could ride the coaster.

...

It appears the Cadillac Cars and the Turnpike Cars could be moved or removed as well.
 

Intricks

Strata Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Well now, that just made things interesting, especially the the "looping" piece. It would qualify as a few "Worlds whatevers), wouldnt it? Height, drop, length, speed, amount of inversions and even a potential first if the "looping" is eluding to a Vertical loop.

This now, more or less, is up Cedar Points alley.
 

Hyde

Matt SR
Staff member
Moderator
Social Media Team
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

And it's worth mentioning that as Rob Decker had mentioned in our interview with him during Gatekeeper's opening (3:14 in the video below), it takes a number of years for a roller coaster project to come to fruition - he said around five years. Whatever is to happen in 2016 is already set in stone.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qimGo74uKCA&t=3m14s[/youtube]

The Sandusky Register has a history of intercepting leaks - they were the first to report Cedar Point's wing coaster.

Tallest dive coaster in the world? I dig it.
 

Intricks

Strata Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

It will also go into a tunnel, so could this mean the drop itself is longer than 220ft?
 

Hyde

Matt SR
Staff member
Moderator
Social Media Team
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Oblivion is 65 ft. tall with a 180 ft. drop.

Using that same ratio, this dive coaster would have a 615 ft. drop! :razz:

Something many have said is that since the water table is so high (the park is in the middle of a lake after all), digging down can be difficult. This is also true as soil is very shallow in the area, meaning you run into bedrock quickly. This is thanks in part to the glaciers that moved all of the soil during that last pesky Ice Age.

I dunno - added tunnel would maybe give an addition 20 to 40 ft. in drop?
 

SaiyanHajime

Strata Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Wow! Thanks for finding that out Hyde...

What's wit the surge of diving machines lately??

Is there any evidence to say that this is more than just a proposal? Could it be one of many possible options they're looking into? Because it does seem a weird choice, tbh. And "2 drops, 2 inversions" is just conjuring up Busch dive machine images.
 

ECG

East Coast(er) General
Staff member
Administrator
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre - 2016+ Speculation

Joey said:
And "2 drops, 2 inversions" is just conjuring up Busch dive machine images.
Yeah, that's why they're going for 4 inversions.
CP has always gotta go bigger, faster, better! Although that last bit wasn't really the case with Gatekeeper. :p
 

_koppen

Hyper Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

A quick look shows that since Magnum was built Cedar Point have built 8 thrill coasters and 1 children's coaster.

Are there no families visiting this park? Don't they deserve a high quality family ride like Juvelen or Winjas?
I just don't see the point with another big thrill coaster at Cedar Point. If they really wan't another thrill ride why not fix Mean Streak?
 
S

SimonSays99

Guest
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

While this might not be a kiddie coaster I think that Dive Machines are - except the first drop - quite tame. The cars are wide so forces must be calculated with that in mind.

Generally I do Dive Machines only once to get the credit but my highlight coasters are the more forceful variants.
 

jokerman

Giga Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

I've only experienced one dive machine, but I found it to be distinctly average, and in a park with the ride selection that Cedar Point has I don't really think it's going to add much other than the gimmick.
 

Hyde

Matt SR
Staff member
Moderator
Social Media Team
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

Screamscape included this brief mention from Bryan Edwards in their report of the memo leak:

The Point’s Bryan Edwards confirmed that the B&M coaster is just one of several proposals the park is looking at for the 2016 season.

So continue RMC Mean Streak speculation! :roll:

Also, on family-based attractions. Yes, the park could absolutely use more family based rides. Of late, classic family ride staples such as the Space Spiral, Paddlewheel Excursions, and White Water Landing have gone the way of the dinosaur. However, there have been new family, non-roller coaster additions. The revamp of the Old Berenstain Bears Country kiddie area to Planet Snoopy, Shoot the Rapids, Wind Seeker, Luminosity show and revamp of Iron Dragon Midway, and the latest Gemini Midway revamp (which introduced a Disco-Coaster and Flying Scooters). As for family-oriented roller coasters, there is Jr. Gemini (now Wilderness Run) and Woodstock Express, and the older Cedar Creek Mine Ride and Iron Dragon. I guess Blue Streak and Corkscrew can be considered more moderate roller coasters as well for intermediate riders.

So yes, there's been effort to maintain new, family attractions. And yes, there is always more than can be done. And yes, a removal of the Turnpike Cars of Cadillac Cars would be a very negative impact on family ride count. (especially considering that the front of the park Cadillac Cars are much better!)
 
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

There's not a lack of things to do for families in my opinion. Yah, the thrill rides obviously outnumber the family attractions, but like Hyde said, they have redone a lot of the Camp Snoopy area (including that Pipe Scream thing near the kiddie area), made the Berenstein Bears area into Planet Snoopy, and also have some family rides scattered throughout the park. If they remove family rides, yeah, that sucks, but they have to look out for what's best for them, which is probably another thrill ride. And they also have another car ride in the park, so it's not the biggest loss in the world.

As far as a DM goes, I'm not super thrilled about it myself. It has been a while since Cedar Point has done something that has wowed me, and I don't think a DM would fit that bill. A good addition, sure, and a new cred close to home, but with the same attitude I had toward Gatekeeper, I won't be rushing to ride it.
 

Hyde

Matt SR
Staff member
Moderator
Social Media Team
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

[strike]And for those who really, REALLY love following all the pre-construction action, Cedar Point has pointed one of their webcams towards the Raptor Cobra Roll/Marina entrance area.

https://www.cedarpoint.com/online-fun/l ... m/camera-2

camera2.jpg


EDIT: What the heck, might as well include the webcam placed atop TTD to also give an overview of the park in winter. You can actually see some of the demo work on the theater in the bottom right corner.

camera1.jpg
[/strike]

UPDATE - It Cedar Point just likes changing around those webcams! :wink:
 

Ashstrodamus

Mega Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

Great, I was hoping Kings Dominion would be getting a new big coaster since CW, Cedar Point, and Kings Island have all had new coasters since KD built I305. That's okay though because Carowinds is about the same driving distance for me and I've never been. I'll go there sometime this upcoming summer. Fury325
 

bmac

Giga Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

There's something charming about seeing Cedar Point covered in snow.
 

steel

Mega Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

Tbh if this got built I would float away and die in the vacuum of space. Every park needs a dive machine, they are such strong coasters. They're capacity monsters, they cater well to large groups riding together, they are relatively compact and inexpensive, they are pretty much unlike any other coaster experience, and they are sooooo much fun.

I would just like to point Cedar Fair in the direction of Canada's Wonderland, Valleyfair, and Worlds of Fun next. Valleyfair is a park that would make a killing with a small to mid-size dive machine. Burn down Excalibur and make that corner of the park necessary again.
 

Ethan

Strata Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

steel said:
Tbh if this got built I would float away and die in the vacuum of space. Every park needs a dive machine, they are such strong coasters. They're capacity monsters, they cater well to large groups riding together, they are relatively compact and inexpensive, they are pretty much unlike any other coaster experience, and they are sooooo much fun.

Thats the first time I've ever seen someone call Dive Coasters "kinda cheap" haha
 

steel

Mega Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

Ethan said:
steel said:
Tbh if this got built I would float away and die in the vacuum of space. Every park needs a dive machine, they are such strong coasters. They're capacity monsters, they cater well to large groups riding together, they are relatively compact and inexpensive, they are pretty much unlike any other coaster experience, and they are sooooo much fun.

Thats the first time I've ever seen someone call Dive Coasters "kinda cheap" haha

Yeah I get what you mean, but considering the cost of other major B&M models - $28m for Leviathan, $24m for Banshee, $25m for Gatekeeper... $15.6m for a coaster the size and power of Griffon is definitely in the realm of inexpensive as far as I'm concerned (and I assume that includes theming and stuff, which this one probably wouldn't have nearly as much of). That's a lot of coaster for your money.
 

njn63

Mega Poster
Re: Cedar Point Closes Good Time Theatre-B&M Dive Coaster 20

steel said:
Yeah I get what you mean, but considering the cost of other major B&M models - $28m for Leviathan, $24m for Banshee, $25m for Gatekeeper... $15.6m for a coaster the size and power of Griffon is definitely in the realm of inexpensive as far as I'm concerned (and I assume that includes theming and stuff, which this one probably wouldn't have nearly as much of). That's a lot of coaster for your money.
You're comparing it to some of the most expensive coasters in the country. Pretty much anything is going to look cheap relative to those. :)
 
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